HELP need a bigger oil pan SBC

[racprops]

And as for WHY a BBC oil pumps: Check this out: https://garage.grumpysperformance.c...high-volume-high-press-or-both-oil-pump.2294/

 

[racprops]

PS I did get a good larger Oil Pan...with a good baffle on the bottom.

 

[racprops]

I know that OD is hanging out a little bit, but here is what was on the tail housing of that 4L80: A big old drum Brake....I added a Late Model 4 Wheel Drive Ford with its transfer case hung out back...

 

[HotWheelsBurban]

3500HD or motor home transmission....

 

[racprops]

3500HD or motor home transmission....

I was told Motor home with stright cut gears.

Rich

 

[racprops]

First thing: Got a pan.

Second thing:

I have read and hear that statement over and over about Vans and Trucks.

If that was true, IF it IS IMPOSSIBLE to get great MPG BECAUSE of having a Pickup Truck or a Van, then it would be impossible for a tall non-Aerodynamic Heavier 2019 Express van powered by a Gasoline 4.3 V6 even with all the super tech and a 8 speed with its final gear ratio of .65 into 3.42 Would be running about 1400RPMs @ 55MPH and 1600 @ 65MPH.

So we have a heavier, less areo Express Van underpowered with a baby engine with nearly the gears and Low RPMs I am shooting for getting a EPA rating of 19MPG City and 29MPG Highway.

HOW did that happen??

As for my 93 G20:

About the not being blown off the roads, and of Aerodynamics:

I bought my 93 Star Craft Custom Van after having stock Chevy vans for decades (1978 till around 2005 when I bought the 93,) I was concerned that with the raised roof and side ground effects would make winds worst for driving.

I drove a 74 Chevy van full time during the 80s and crossed the US on many times, in the 90s and into the 2000s it was then a 78 van. Again we did a lot of road trips all over.

I was VERY used to fighting for control with cross winds and when passing or being passed by BIG RIGS. The bow wake of air would buffer and push my vans all over the road; I am sure near every Van owner knows what I am talking about.

My first road trip showed me that was NOT a problem. Cruising at 75 MPH I was over taking a Big Rig and I braced for the fight as I over took the cab…and..and WTF no fight, I breezed by this big truck….

Must have been a trick cross wind that stopped the bow wake of the big rig, BUT it happened again and again, almost no effects of passing trucks, and even when I was over took by even faster big rigs.

OMG The stream lining ground effects of the Star Craft panels which I loved for their LOOKS really works. I have had the van for 15 years now and LOVE this effect.

I believe these ground effects keep air from under the van and I believe this nearly stops the effects of bow wakes and losers the effects of cross wind on my G20 van.

But there seems to be a catch, as far as I have been able to learn this ONLY works with the old Star Craft costum vans, the newer look alike vans are not close enough to the ground for this to work.

Also I know big rigs do everything to help their MPG, and my van looks a lot like most newer rigs, and I see deflectors on the trailers that seem to cut air from under the trailers as well.

They would not add anything that did not work.

As these only came on these old van and many people really are not interested in completely rebuilding an old van my best suggestion is to either lower the newer vans or add to the front air dam and side skirting to get this effect.

Rich

 

[racprops]

I am very aware of the fine line between the correct torque range and lugging an engine. These are my starting point for research.

I did a lot of research into MPG.

I tried HHO, special tuners called interrupt between the PCM and its sensors trying to fool the car to use less fuel. And a few other odd MPG devices.

The only thing I found that worked on my 2000 Merc GM was leaning the A/F ratio to 16:1, on that car on the highway I was able to get 35MPG @ 65MPH, but as I could not make the switch to a lean burn and back to normal it had a major loss of power.

The 80s Camaros TPI cars had such a set up. It was called at that time a Lean Burn Cruse setting, now it is called Highway Mode, what is did/does, was/is under light load, light throttle it automatically leaned the A/F mix, and with nearly any change in load and/or throttle smoothly switch out of Highway Mode to normal A/F mixes giving back full power.

This mode took a 20/25 MPG car to 30/35 MPG, just that little switch hidden inside the PCM.

And I did NOT make this up, I first learned about this on a site called Third Gen.org decades ago, here is a fast search showing some data about tuning highway mode as proof: https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-prom/745545-highway-mode-interesting-observation.html

My thought is we MIGHT be able to do a tune in our CPMs to do this highway mode. I lack the resources but do have a few 03/04 and a couple of 98, 2000 PCMs and a fair amount of knowledge about these modes. And a bunch of test gear that can be moved over to my 03 from my 2000 Mercury. To test it.

This is the best I can do and plan with the vans current stock 3.42 rear end gears. There is the possibility that my engine may make great torque at 1000RPMs, but I am not counting on it. The ideal is to gear everything at the engines torque peak, under or over by much and she will start drinking.

SO you cannot gear a stock engine with a torque peak of 2800/3000 to pull at 1500RPMs and get good MPG. So I am building an engine that peak at 2000 RPM and gear close to that.

Once it is built I will do as careful testing at all available speeds, RPMs with all the gears I have to test. THEN as I have a howling rear end will then rebuild it with what will seem to be the best gear ratio, with a range of 2.73 to 4.11 I can choose a gear that may be ideal.

So I start with a best build I can do, a 383, 9.5 compression, everything built for MPG, ceramic coated heads and pistons, telfon coated pistons skirts, Rhoads Roller lifters giving me a variable cam, a cam selected to allow a torque peak at 2000 or less, but thanks to the lifters will then turn into a power engine at 2500 to its max RPMS of 5000RPMs, fed by a 1987 Chevy TPI intake system.

Then to add to all of that I have a chip for the PCM to engage Lean Burn Mode which in the 80s Camaros allow them to go from 20/25 TO 30/35MPG.

To that I will be adding water injection, and extra EGR. (or not)


My Van

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/...

The only thing that I cannot remember is was my first road trip made in the 93 was done on the Stock wheels and tires OR had I already swapped to the 18 inch wheels with load and speed rated low profile tires. The over height IS the same as the stock wheels and tires just more wheel and less tire.

I have proven over and over again and again running these types of wheels and tires improve handling greatly. At least with the softer wheels and TIREs on a G20, the one ton 8 bolt wheels and HEAVY duty tires run of those trucks feel as hard as does my 18s.

The floppy Explorer NOW handles like a good big car, not a race car but MUCH better.

And PLUS with the 18 inch wheels and tires on my 93 Van is I had a blowout at 80MPH with the front right side…and unlike a common blow out there was NO fight to maintain control, in fact I only knew I had a problem by how she started pulling to the right, once I crossed 4 lanes of highway slowing down was a little surprised to find a blowout….

I have not driven a new custom van with the same look like the newer Express vans, There seems to be only one company doing these conversions, Explorer, It looks like Explorer Conversions run with greater ground clearance and I think that defeats the ground effects.

Lastly there are two Express vans documented to get 29/30MPG with stock bodies…so it is NOT the box causing crappy MPG.

And there are a bunch of changes and improvements I have made as well.

Rich

 

[tayto]

for anybody reading this: straight cut gears are weaker than helical gears. straight cut gears in 4L80Es are rare and only came in extreme duty (HEAVY) vehicles. Just because the 4L80E came from a motor home does not automatically mean they have the "elusive" straight cut gears. The only way you know is by tearing down the unit. these gears don't thrust load the pinion like a helical gear does. that is the only advantage of them and you would only take advantage of this in a vehicle well over 10K lbs. they are not needed or wanted in a regular car/truck/van unless you like extra gear noise when you're driving.

 

[racprops]

Sorry but I am told differently by other transmission guys:

Gary who is going through my 4L80.

BTW straight cut gears are MUCH stronger than the spiral cut gears, but they are noisy.

Regarding the gears, in the 1960s and early 1970s, there were two of the Muncie 4 speed transmissions that had the exact same ratio - the M21 and the M22 ... the only difference was the M22 had straight cut gears and the M21 were spiral. The M22 was designed for racing ... it was nicknamed the 'Rock Crusher' due to the gear noise it made.



I found other reports about those M22 transmissions as well. https://www.chevelles.com/threads/m22-or-m21-whats-the-diff.79154/

“The M22 is the "rockcrusher" tranny. It's a bit more heavy duty than the M21 and much rarer. It's called a rockcrusher due to it straighter cut gears which whine ( and are stronger ). The M21 is a standard Muncie 4 speed.”



David Moseley a lifelong transmission rebuilder says:

If it has straight cut planets I’d leave them they are very strong. They are made for heavy vehicles. In a racing application a lot of people say the helical gears hold up much better. The noise is a huge concern most folks can’t hear it .my experience the straight cuts are very rare to see .

 

[Schurkey]

Are they really "straight-cut" gears? I thought they were helical, but with less angle than the regular helical gears.

Lower-angle gears would have less thrust load. Straight-cut gears would have essentially zero thrust.

Or you could be like Citroen, and use opposite-angle gears, where the thrust from one side of the gear set is offset by the thrust from the other side of the gear set.

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Thus leading to the "herringbone" Citroen trademark.

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