Look how they massacred my boy...Now what to do about it?

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RevRun

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Tried both UCAs in the passenger side. The images below show what I was trying to describe above. With the driver side in the pass position the offset to the rear helps with caster but the angle of the ball joint cup would move out of line with with steering axis.

Passenger UCA:

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Driver UCA:
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xAFNYx

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Nad, thanks for your input. I think I will go ahead with knocking out the remaining tabs, clean up the rough spots and see how it goes.

As for the numbers, it looks like the remaining tabs were limiting the adjustment range a fair bit. I agree on the camber target. Looking to end up near 0 if possible but mainly want to dial in more caster for a more stable steering feel at speed.

I am running a rough country 2-3" lift which is effectively keys + diff drop + UCAs and 2" blocks in the rear. I have dialed down to just about the lowest ride height with the new keys which about 1" higher than factory ( 22.5" from hub center to fender lip).
I think running this low is causing some of the problem as it looks like I gain negative camber as the truck rides higher. Taking a video from the front while I slowly jack up from the frame I see the tops of the tires swing inboard.

Factory height +1"
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Factory height +2"
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Factory height +3"
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Is this in-line with your experience?
WAIT! THIS IS KIND OF WHAT I'M DEALING WITH! Except it's ONLY my front driver and it's significantly more cambered.
 

xAFNYx

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I have the same lift too, but it came on the Truck when I bought it. 2 shops couldn't figure out what was wrong with it.
 

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RevRun

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I have the same lift too, but it came on the Truck when I bought it. 2 shops couldn't figure out what was wrong with it.
Wow that looks like excessive negative camber which is about in line with what mine was like with t bars cranked a lot. You may take a peek and see how far your adjustment bolts are turned in to get an idea how far the prior owner went. Does the truck ride pretty rough? I found that was the case if I left mine cranked up too far after install.
 

xAFNYx

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Wow that looks like excessive negative camber which is about in line with what mine was like with t bars cranked a lot. You may take a peek and see how far your adjustment bolts are turned in to get an idea how far the prior owner went. Does the truck ride pretty rough? I found that was the case if I left mine cranked up too far after install.
Uhh. I don't really know bc I've never driven a lifted Truck. Or even a truck like this. I know the steering is a little sloppy and loose. And it hits bumps a bit harder than I anticipated a lifted Truck would. I wouldn't even know what I was looking at if I climbed under to look at the tbars. Both shops didn't say anything ab them.
 

xAFNYx

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Okay so I just did some quick research. You're saying that that side torsion is cranked too many turns?
Wow that looks like excessive negative camber which is about in line with what mine was like with t bars cranked a lot. You may take a peek and see how far your adjustment bolts are turned in to get an idea how far the prior owner went. Does the truck ride pretty rough? I found that was the case if I left mine cranked up too far after install.
 

jhornsby3

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To be very honest. You will get better results if you turn the shop in to the BBB. I had to do this with a new to us pick up when I had injectors replaced. Or thought I was getting them replaced. They paid my full costs plus hotel due to an issue as well as five oil changes and new upper and lower valve covers for both sides. Shoddy work cost them twice what I paid for the injector R&R. Plus the BBB will report it to the state's AG Consumer's division. If the BBB doesn't get you the results then the AG will.

Just a thought.
 

xAFNYx

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Wow that looks like excessive negative camber which is about in line with what mine was like with t bars cranked a lot. You may take a peek and see how far your adjustment bolts are turned in to get an idea how far the prior owner went. Does the truck ride pretty rough? I found that was the case if I left mine cranked up too far after install.
I just peeked at the torsion set up. They both look about even and not necessarily cranked in too much, but I did notice the Keys and bolts are on an angle and not vertical.
 

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Luke Stratton

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For the alignment also be advised they sell different degrees of cam washers so after you clean up the knock out area if they can't get the right degree with stock hardware they should suggest new hardware if their a decent shop. I bought the tool did my own knock outs myself to save money and to ensure its was done right, I have a hard time finding a shop that will do it (like I would) right. Being as I'm broke I have difficulty doing some things to my rides so its necessary to have the shop do the work. I don't mind paying for the work just expect them to do at least as good as I could. Anyway the alignment shop was upset that I did the knock outs myself and treated me like I didn't know what I was doing, mind you I've been wrenching for 40+ years so that kinda pissed me off and I should have said screw it and took it somewhere else but figured I give benefit of the doubt $318 later it was good they had to get new hardware to align it.
 

RevRun

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Ok, back with good news. In short...she's back together, tracking straight down the road with reasonable camber/caster numbers.

In long....

Fiddled around with swapping the arms driver/pass and found a potential bind at full droop due to the cant in the end ball joint end of the arm. Swapped them back to their respective sides with the cleaned up slots and new cam washers and bolts. Eye ball'ed her for straight-ish and limped down to the alignment shop (had to change up to a different one than the previously mentioned shop but still had confidence in these guys).

After they got it on the rack they spent an hour dialing things in as best as they could and ended up with camber at -0.05/-0.87 (L/R) and caster at 1.43/1.04 (L/R). That was with the rear UCA arms pulled full inboard to slot max and the front about mid slot. All they really had to work with was the front UCA mounting positions, moving out to improve caster but going more (+) on camber or vis versa. Given they had done as well as the hardware would let them I took her home. Immediately noticed an improvement in the road noise now that I am riding flatter on the tread and a bit of an improvement in wheel feel and some return to center, but still very light steering.

After about a week of driving I felt comfortable in it, but after letting my wife drive and seeing her a bit stressed managing the still very light steering I decided to go ahead and move on to the next phase. Swapping bushings.

With the rig back up on stands, I pulled the UCAs and dicked around trying to find a good way to press out the bushings Rough Country shipped them with. Due to the very small available land outside the bushing flange I struggled to get a good backing surface to press against. Ended up cutting two flats off each flange and cobbling together a backer plate with 1-2-3 blocks and plate and used my ball press. It worked well enough for this job :D

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Now that the old bushings were out I went ahead and pressed in the eccentric bushings I had ordered a while back. Pressing these in went much easier than removal thankfully.
Installed them as suggested by a tech at SPC (https://www.spcalignment.com) which was rear biased outboard and front bushing biased inboard to maximise my potential to gain caster. As an aside; I got to say these guys are great to talk to. Very knowledgeable about their products, were able to pull mfg drawings and get specific dimensions that aren't typically listed on their product pages over the phone, and one guy even had a K2500 burb he was working on.

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Bolted the UCAs back in and gave her the ol' eyeball-O-linement and headed back to the shop. Lucked out in that the shop didn't charge for the second alignment covering it under their '1yr warranty' even after letting them know that I had swapped some of the hardware (wasn't looking to short change anyone). Said it's all the same to them and that I was covered for as many alignements as I like no-questions asked thru that 1 year. This gave me pause as to the quality of their work but after seeing their clean shop/equipment and talking to the techs, I don't have any worries. They had it back off the rack in about 30 mins and was able to get me back in a more reasonable range for numbers.
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Night and day difference on the drive home. Wheel self-centered great after turns, the additional steering weight made for fewer micro corrections, and everything felt very stable at speed. Very happy with where things ended up at this point.

I think it's safe to say I am done messing around with the suspension for now.
Will keep an eye on the conditions of these new bushings as their inboard/outboard positions *could* cause premature wear.
While the bodged slots where limiting adjustment I have to believe that the Rough Country arms were also partially responsible for making this a pain to get to reasonable numbers. While my side by side comparisons to the stock UCAs didn't show much of a difference, I still believe the RC arms have to be a bit longer.

@Luke Stratton - When choosing new eccentric washers and bolts I did see some differences in advertised adjustment range. The idea of different adjustment ranges confused me as looking at how the washers work, they really all need to be designed to a single outside diameter to snugly fit within the flanges they bear on and the hole *should* be offset the appropriate amount to match with the slot length after the knock outs are removed. Assuming the OD's are the same, a hole offset too far from center would bind with the slots, and a hole not offset out enough would work fine but would not allow the full range of adjustment the slots provide. See my crappy rendering of an ideal washer (blue) and one with less offset (yellow). Then again what do I know. Just keyboard theorizing here.
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Say @xAFNYx , did you ever figure out your camber issue?
 
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