Truck went dead today...(starter went dead)

[PlayingWithTBI]

Hmmm, has anyone thought about installing a "Ford" style solenoid on the fender near the battery and jumping permanently the starter drive to the main terminal on the starter, then running the key start wire up to the solenoid? The reason I was thinking about that is because I'd love to be able to jump the starter without crawling under the truck - I don't do bend-overs well anymore. I don't know, just a thought...

 

[kenh]

The truck had an Optima battery in it when I bought it. It was down to less than half of it's ratted CCA. I have a new battery in it now. I cleaned the battery ground to the frame and the smaller cables from the frame to the engine and firewall. I did nothing on the starter itself. The engine has shorty headers that directly replace the iron exhaust manifolds. That i why I was thinking it may be heat related???? I'll need to get under the truck and check out the starter connections. Also considering adding a ground cable from the battery cable on the frame to the engine block.

The gauges, radio and heater fan turned off when the key was turned to start, just like it supposed to happen.

What is curious to me is why after wiggling wires it would not start but 5 minutes later it fired right up while doing nothing but turn the key??? Maybe in the ignition switch itself????

Which brings me to a side question. Does this model (1990, C1500) have an accessory position in the switch? There is one position forward where nothing happens, I have to have the switch "on" to operate the radio.

Ken

Just to be clear...When i say "no start", the starter does not operate. No click/chatter like a low battery. Just dead silence!

 

[HawkDsl]

My 93 C3500 7.4 has a starter problem related to heat. The longer the trip the less the starter wants to fire. It’s a newish starter. I’m going to try a new starter cellenoid.

You need to wrap that starter so it wont get cooked under the exhaust.. Doesn't matter if you have headers or not. Summit and Jegs sell a flexible cloth starter heat shield that's similar to what you put your arm in for blood pressure check. The stock heat shields
up to my year (89) were small, and only covered the solenoid... and it was metal also.. so it heat soaked anyway. No more starter problems related to heat with the wrap (it covers the entire starter, back to front.)

 

[454cid]

Do you not have a big ground cable going to the block? If not someone probably removed it.

Both my V8s have grounds to the block directly from the battery. My 4cyl Saturn grounds to the bell housing, I think.

 

[RawbDidIt]

The truck had an Optima battery in it when I bought it. It was down to less than half of it's ratted CCA. I have a new battery in it now. I cleaned the battery ground to the frame and the smaller cables from the frame to the engine and firewall. I did nothing on the starter itself. The engine has shorty headers that directly replace the iron exhaust manifolds. That i why I was thinking it may be heat related???? I'll need to get under the truck and check out the starter connections. Also considering adding a ground cable from the battery cable on the frame to the engine block.

The gauges, radio and heater fan turned off when the key was turned to start, just like it supposed to happen.

What is curious to me is why after wiggling wires it would not start but 5 minutes later it fired right up while doing nothing but turn the key??? Maybe in the ignition switch itself????

Which brings me to a side question. Does this model (1990, C1500) have an accessory position in the switch? There is one position forward where nothing happens, I have to have the switch "on" to operate the radio.

Ken

Just to be clear...When i say "no start", the starter does not operate. No click/chatter like a low battery. Just dead silence!

Loose connections do strange things, I've had my terminal connection be strong enough to run the stereo, but not the starter. If the electronics cut off when turned to start, I'd say there's more likely candidates for the failure than the ignition switch because it's doing part of the job, indicating that it's probably doing the rest of its job as well, and something else is preventing it from engaging the starter. Test resistance to negative terminal of battery from starter housing, should be as low as resistance to ground strap on frame approx 4" from starter, if it doesn't have the ground strap I'm mentioning, compare to resistance for the engine ground, and consider putting a ground there directly from the negative terminal, 4ga is a good cable for that purpose. Make sure the mounting bolts are tight on the starter while you're down there. If that checks out, check resistance across power wire from positive terminal on battery to the positive lead on the starter. Give the cable a good wiggle and yank while testing, resistance shouldn't change while moving, and test leads should be on the battery and the starter so you test the connections as well. My guess is you find your problem in there.

Sent from my SM-N976V using Tapatalk

 

[HotWheelsBurban]

Check your connections, and check the terminals on the cables and the starter and solenoid too. When my truck dumped Mom and wouldn't start when hot, it turned out to be that the long positive cable (the one that goes across the fan shroud to the computer) had bad spots in it that I couldn't see. Corrosion in the cables is a known problem area for these trucks. Also, the small terminal on the starter solenoid was a little bit loose. That wire goes to the ignition, and it is what activates the solenoid to pull the plunger that puts the starter drive into the flywheel teeth. Most of the mysterious electrical problems are caused by something simple like a bad connection or grounds. It's just finding them that's the tedious part.... but my truck was giving all the symptoms of hot no-start.

 

[kenh]

I have to get under it this weekend and do some checking. There is no ground LARGE ground from the frame to the engine block. Only the small braided cable down near the starter. I intend on adding a "starter" cable from the frame to the engine. That seemed jicky not having one. Yes some sort of heat shield to cover the whole starter seems like a good idea. I have it in my head the solenoid is failing under heat just like an ignition coil will on occasion.

Ken

 

[alpinecrick]

Although you haven't mentioned if this a TBI or Vortec.....or a John Deere.....when my 91 truck did this it was a cracked ignition module. This was almost 20 years ago. When I couldn't figure it out I drove it to the dealer. It took the tech about 2 minutes to diagnose it and 5 minutes to replace it.

 

[thinger2]

Most likely a loose connection or corrosion.
The factory battery cables can look just fine on the outside but be rotted under the plastic.
Bad grounds are real common.
Heat soak is not necessarily the starter motor being too hot.
It is a known problem that the "s" wire (keyed hot) at the solenoid gets to hot.
When a wire gets hot, the resistance goes up and it will not conduct enough to turn the starter.
When it cools a bit, it will.
The cure is to install a ford type solenoid that relocates that wire away from the heat.
its called a "hot start kit"
Summit has them for about 75 bucks but you can make you own cheap.
Been a chebbie problem since about 1958 or so
When you buy a chevy, put gas in it, drive it home, and put a hot start kit on it

 

[thinger2]

Hmmm, has anyone thought about installing a "Ford" style solenoid on the fender near the battery and jumping permanently the starter drive to the main terminal on the starter, then running the key start wire up to the solenoid? The reason I was thinking about that is because I'd love to be able to jump the starter without crawling under the truck - I don't do bend-overs well anymore. I don't know, just a thought...

crazy talk. Its not the crawling under that causes the problem. Its not having enough room to drink a beer without pouring it in yer ear while youre under it!