2017 Cherokee 3.2 Intermittent prob-suspect TIPM

[movietvet]

This is one of those DAYS, I wish I did not do this. 2017 Cherokee. Recently replaced the oil filter cartridge/cooler housing because of oil leaks. That is all good but came to me yesterday for a different reason. The driver has had intermittent warning lights come on the dash and one time, while driving, the vehicle shut down and she had no power steering and pulled over and did a restart and has been fine ever since but still the lights intermittently. Came to me, no lights on. Intermittent red battery light, red electrical system/throttle control light and amber start/stop light. Did a charging system check and charging 14.36 volts with headlights and blower on high speed. Idles at 14.33 with just engine running. Shows right at 13.0 volts before start and holds above 10.4 volts when battery loaded. Did find that the vehicle OE battery has been replaced with a 94 series AGM battery but is supposed to have a 48 series AGM battery instead. The 94 is for non start/stop vehicles and the 48 is for the start/stop vehicles. Battery date code is from Nov. of 2022. She cannot remember if that is when battery was replaced. I drove yesterday and had no lights or problems. Today, has the amber CEL on but cannot pull codes. Will not pull codes and will not communicate but has no drivability problems. I do have constant 12 volts at MIL/CEL connector and has good ground. I get 12+ volts at connector. The scanner works in my own vehicle but not in the Jeep. I have checked fuses with none found to have a problem.

Any suggestions or anything to jar my brain for what I may have forgotten about or missed? I suspect a known weak area of the TIPM.

 

[movietvet]

I decided to chance it and unhooked the battery, in hopes of turning out the CEL. Thru 2 starts, the CEL is off but still cannot communicate. I know the code reader works, it works on my Tahoe. Checked all fuses and used DVOM and verified the 12 volt signal and ground at the CEL diagnostic connector, under the dash.

Is raining here. Swapped my Tahoe back under my canopy and moved the Jeep to end of driveway. CEL is back on as soon as I started it.

Oh efffffing well!

 

[movietvet]

How to Identify and Fix TIPM Failure on Your Jeep

For a working body, you need a pumping heart, right? Similarly, for a running Jeep, you need a fully functioning TIPM.

offroadersguild.com

Turns out that this TIPM or better known as fuse block, is a well known weak spot on many MOPAR vehicles over many years. Listed but out of stock at RA and not even listed at Parts Geek. I did find it at MOPAR Parts for $334.48 instead of the normal $497.00. My shop owner friend says he has to replace these on a regular basis and has done about 20 of them in the 1 year the shop has been open. The symptoms match up with some of what she said was going on and that I could not communicate with the code puller. I have pulled codes on this vehicle before when she had a leaking oil cooler assembly and it set a code for low oil pressure.

My close friend, shop owner, has been in his new shop 1 year this month. In that time he has seen very similar problems, like on this Cherokee, and each time he has diagnosed as a TIPM problem and fixed them each time. In one year, he has replaced close to a dozen TIPM units. When you look up both options for the 2017 Cherokee, they are out of stock. Out of stock because so many are bad. There is a newer upgraded unit than the 2 shown at RA. Part #68264530AF

The owner is deciding on what to do. She is aware that percentages point to the TIPM but I cannot guarantee the replacement until I would do deeper inspections. She may have the dealer inspect and agree and then have me do the replacement. Shall see.

 

[someotherguy]

These later model vehicles are nuts, especially when you get into TIPM issues on Mopars, as you've discovered. Everything you described to me -sounds- like TIPM issues but I am very, very far from an expert so don't base any decision off my input there - it's just that "oh, yeah" reaction as I began reading the symptoms.

I'm a little confused about the battery situation, though. What's the 8th VIN digit on this Jeep? I looked up a few 2017 Cherokee models with the 3.2 and they all show VIN S and Advance's site recommends the same H7 (group 94) battery with the lowest rated one at 800CCA - seems more than sufficient for a little 3.2. I know almost zero about the stop/start vehicles but it does make sense they'd need a different battery than one not equipped with it, as they're constantly beating on the starting/charging system with all that frequent starter operation.

Richard

 

[movietvet]

These later model vehicles are nuts, especially when you get into TIPM issues on Mopars, as you've discovered. Everything you described to me -sounds- like TIPM issues but I am very, very far from an expert so don't base any decision off my input there - it's just that "oh, yeah" reaction as I began reading the symptoms.

I'm a little confused about the battery situation, though. What's the 8th VIN digit on this Jeep? I looked up a few 2017 Cherokee models with the 3.2 and they all show VIN S and Advance's site recommends the same H7 (group 94) battery with the lowest rated one at 800CCA - seems more than sufficient for a little 3.2. I know almost zero about the stop/start vehicles but it does make sense they'd need a different battery than one not equipped with it, as they're constantly beating on the starting/charging system with all that frequent starter operation.

Richard

When I looked at RA, it was very specific. With start/stop use a 48 series AGM and without start/stop use 94 series AGM battery. If I looked up a Grand Cherokee with Start/stop, it had a main battery listed and an auxiliary battery listed, that was for the start/stop. There must be a reason that the Cherokee was specific about whether the Cherokee had start/stop or not. If I am going to attempt to fix something and the application calls for a specific battery, I am going to point it out.

 

[someotherguy]

So bizarre that would be the spec, since typically the group 48 battery tends to be a lower CCA than the group 94. Again I don't know anything about the stop/start vehicles but I have heard some utilize an auxiliary battery. Some of them seem to use a SMALL auxiliary battery, that powers, I don't know what? From the size of them I'd almost have to assume they only provide buffer type power to keep the operating voltage from falling too low while a start event draws down the main battery. For example, some newer Mercedes models use this TINY 1.2Ah battery - for what, I really don't know. I stumbled across these while shopping for the little 1.3Ah batteries we use in the wireless tow lights, to give you an idea of the size of this thing. They're kinda like two packs of cigs taped together.

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Richard

 

[movietvet]

The samples of the auxiliary start/stop batteries that I have seen, look like a motorcycle battery.

 

[someotherguy]

The samples of the auxiliary start/stop batteries that I have seen, look like a motorcycle battery.

Yep, so they're small, just not as small as those suckers I just posted. My best guess is my quick theory about a buffer supply to keep the voltage drop manageable while re-starting the engine.

Richard

 

[movietvet]

Seems the 2017 Cherokee, with start/stop does not use an auxiliary battery and the Grand Cherokee does. At least that is what I found by application. The Grand Cherokee has the main battery under the passenger front seat and the auxiliary start/stop battery is right next to it under that seat.