4l60e TQ and HP Question

[NickTransmissions]

A retired mechanic who I've used for rear-ends (he lives in Saginaw, MI) always gets his parts from Drive Train Specialists in Detroit ("DTS", https://www.drivetrainspecialists.com/about-us). For him, it's a 45min drive to DTS or a one-day ground shipment.

He claims their bearing sets are OE quality.

Bearing quality has been a recurring topic on GMT400.

YMMV, I'm just repeating what he told me. I literally drove to DTS from his house and picked up the parts he needed.

DTS is good to go; Ive built several rear axles/diffs using parts purchased from them, including bearings and other things like structural covers.

@Aidan Kesler - IMO, the trickest part about rebuilding/setting up differentials is getting the pinion depth just right. I have the Kent Moore ring and pinion set up tool which takes a lot of the guesswork out but if you don't, take your old inner pinion bearing and grind out the inner diameter of it so you can slip it onto the new pinion gear. This will help make trial and error fitment a lot easier.

Once pinion depth and backlash are correct, the pattern check should pass. Lastly, use a pinion spacer instead of a crush sleeve - I hate those stupid sleeves... Harbor freight has axle bearing pullers, seal/race drivers and OTC makes a good diff carrier bearing puller kit. You shouldnt need an axle spreader...

 

[Erik the Awful]

IMO, the trickest part about rebuilding/setting up differentials is getting the pinion depth just right... take your old inner pinion bearing and grind out the inner diameter of it so you can slip it onto the new pinion gear. This will help make trial and error fitment a lot easier.

Absolutely this. You only get one bearing in a rebuild kit, and I had to cut off the old bearing, so it was trashed. I bought a spare bearing and ground the inside very slightly larger so I could just barely get it on and off.

Lastly, use a pinion spacer instead of a crush sleeve - I hate those stupid sleeves.

Yup. Instead of shopping for a "crush sleeve elminator kit", look for a "solid spacer kit". I discovered it's $70 for a "crush sleeve eliminator" and $20 for a "solid spacer kit". Crush sleeves assume your pinion is shimmed correctly, and you can't un-crush them if you have to add shims. Also, crush sleeves crush further with wear.

 

[Supercharged111]

Absolutely this. You only get one bearing in a rebuild kit, and I had to cut off the old bearing, so it was trashed. I bought a spare bearing and ground the inside very slightly larger so I could just barely get it on and off.


Yup. Instead of shopping for a "crush sleeve elminator kit", look for a "solid spacer kit". I discovered it's $70 for a "crush sleeve eliminator" and $20 for a "solid spacer kit". Crush sleeves assume your pinion is shimmed correctly, and you can't un-crush them if you have to add shims. Also, crush sleeves crush further with wear.

I thought you left the crush sleeve out until pinion depth was correct thought?

 

[NickTransmissions]

I thought you left the crush sleeve out until pinion depth was correct thought?

That's correct but the problem with those dumb things is they are very hard to crush (I used to use my 1" impact to start or a 3/4 breaker bar w/long pipe) but it's very easy to crush them too much, once you do get them started...

You have to get within a certain bearing preload range and it's often a window about 7 inch lbs or so wide, so very easy to overshoot your target especially if you don't build rear ends frequently.

 

[Supercharged111]

That's correct but the problem with those dumb things is they are very hard to crush (I used to use my 1" impact to start or a 3/4 breaker bar w/long pipe) but it's very easy to crush them too much, once you do get them started...

You have to get within a certain bearing preload range and it's often a window about 7 inch lbs or so wide, so very easy to overshoot your target especially if you don't build rear ends frequently.

Yeah I don't like the idea of them myself, as someone who's never had to set up a rear end before. But I do see gear setup in my future at some point. How do you measure for the solid spacer? I'm having a hard time visualizing it as that all lives in the front of the pig.

 

[DerekTheGreat]

It's contrary to popular opinion on here, but I like the 4L60E in our 2002 Tahoe. My wife to be knew the original owner, so we know it's the original unit. It's approaching 285k miles with just filter and fluid changes. It's the best shifting four speed auto I've ever driven. Do I beat on it? No, unless doughnuts in the snow count.

 

[NickTransmissions]

Yeah I don't like the idea of them myself, as someone who's never had to set up a rear end before. But I do see gear setup in my future at some point. How do you measure for the solid spacer? I'm having a hard time visualizing it as that all lives in the front of the pig.

It's a fairly simple process, Ratech provides instructions on their website.

 

[Supercharged111]

It's a fairly simple process, Ratech provides instructions on their website.

Ahh, so it's not 1 piece. It's 1 piece plus shims to dial it in.

 

[NickTransmissions]

It's contrary to popular opinion on here, but I like the 4L60E in our 2002 Tahoe. My wife to be knew the original owner, so we know it's the original unit. It's approaching 285k miles with just filter and fluid changes. It's the best shifting four speed auto I've ever driven. Do I beat on it? No, unless doughnuts in the snow count.

Yea, they can be built to handle power and generally perform well if healthy. The problem with the 4L60Es is that it's luck of the draw in terms of what sort of unit you get...There are examples like yours that last for nearly 300k (or more in some really wild cases) and others that fail before they hit 75k; I rebuilt my share of both but you're talking at the extreme ends of the bell curve when it comes to mean time between overhauls for those units...4L80Es by contrast have a much better track record for longevity as they don't have nearly the extent of vulnerabilities (esp the 97+ units)...

The main problem with the 4L60Es is 3-4 clutch pack failure, which I am coming to believe is primarily driven by inconsistencies in both casting quality of the drums as well as 'quality' of the press fit that exists between the ferrous metal input shaft and aluminum drum.

 

[NickTransmissions]

Ahh, so it's not 1 piece. It's 1 piece plus shims to dial it in.

Yes, there are shims - they set your preload. Simple deal compared to the crush collar...