Load on starter when warm

[daven8844x]

Not likely.


Nothing that matters, if the starter cranks when you turn the key.


How was it tested? Is it fully-charged?


How was it tested? What was the amperage draw when cranking the engine?


If the alternator keeps the battery charged, it doesn't "play at all in this process."


If you turn the key to "Crank" and the starter cranks reliably...they're fine. You haven't complained about the starter refusing to crank, just that it cranks slowly for awhile.


Yes. There's other grounds, but in terms of the starter motor cranking speed, those are the important ones.


Your voltage-drop testing shows the ground cable to be fine.


...and the amperage draw of the starter when cranking.






Just for giggles, have you tried cranking the engine with the serpentine belt removed? Possible you've got a failed alternator or PS or A/C compressor bearing that's stiff on initial movement. (Not likely, but worth popping the belt off to check.)

Ok, so initial start after the truck was warm. Battery measured 12.5v before starting. When started with fuel relay pulled, immediately went to 10.3v and then settled at 10.9v as the starter continued to turn. After that, when starter off, battery measured right at 12v. For each of 3 starts thereafter, immediately went down to 10.5v and settled at 10.9v as it continued to turn.

 

[Schurkey]

1. Battery is not fully charged. 12.5 is about 3/4 charge. 12.6--12.7 is full charge.

2. 10.3 doesn't worry me so much, I see worse than that in the winter

3. Losing half-a-volt at the battery during one cranking cycle may indicate that the battery is weak. But this would depend on how long you cranked it; and of course we know the battery was under-charged when you began.

How was it tested? Is it fully-charged?

How was it tested? What was the amperage draw when cranking the engine?

...and the amperage draw of the starter when cranking.

Again, HOW were the battery and starter tested? How many amps did the starter draw?

 

[daven8844x]

Battery was tested after the truck had warmed up. I drove around a bit, got everything ready to test, shut it off, hooked up my radio shack multimeter, and that was the reading I got.

The battery is about a month old. I took it to autozone to test a couple of days ago. It tested fine, as did the less than year old alternator and the 3 or so year old starter (though I previously did try another new ac delco starter too and it had the same behavior).

Can I test amperage draw with my multimeter? I am also intrigued by the belt off option. I may try that next time the truck is warm. But would that bearing type failure only happen after the truck, is warm? As stated, the truck sounds perfectly normal on a completely cold start. Thanks again!

 

[Schurkey]

Battery was tested after the truck had warmed up. I drove around a bit, got everything ready to test, shut it off, hooked up my radio shack multimeter, and that was the reading I got.

The battery is about a month old. I took it to autozone to test a couple of days ago. It tested fine, as did the less than year old alternator and the 3 or so year old starter (though I previously did try another new ac delco starter too and it had the same behavior).

You are telling me THAT the battery was tested, and that it was "fine". You are not telling me HOW the battery was tested, or what CCA it's good for.

Did they use a "modern" conductance/impedance/resistance/fookin' voodoo hand-held electronic video-game looking device that spit out a thermal-paper listing the results? Did they use a tabletop or stand-mounted tester with a bigass knob that ACTUALLY PULLS AMPERAGE from the battery? Did they use a voltmeter and a non-adjustable load?

Same for the starter and alternator: WHAT WAS THE AMPERAGE DRAW of the starter? Were they tested "on the car" or did you have to remove them? "Off-the-car" testing totally fails to verify the wire harness that connects the alternator, battery, and starter together.

I'm trying to determine if the "testing" was worth two squirts of duck poop.

Can I test amperage draw with my multimeter?

No. Most multimeters are fused at 10 amps, some allow short-term 20 amp loads. Starter testing requires 200+ amperage capacity.

You could do this with an inductive amperage probe connected to your voltmeter, but most folks don't have amperage probes.

I am also intrigued by the belt off option. I may try that next time the truck is warm. But would that bearing type failure only happen after the truck, is warm? As stated, the truck sounds perfectly normal on a completely cold start.

Probably not. Seems unlikely.

 

[Pinger]

Having an issue where when I start my '97 K1500 truck after the engine warms, the first turn of the starter sounds hard and slow like it's not gonna turn over.

Engine warm then shut down. How long before the troublesome restart?
If you shut it down warm then try and restart it immediately - is the problem present?

 

[GoToGuy]

I'd have to look it up, but if i remember correctly it states 30 seconds starter 30 seconds off, 1 minute off, 30 seconds starter, 1 minute off, 30 seconds starter, then 5 minutes off. I haven't had this kind of test in while so i would check the book. But that was the starter duty cycle. You see why the pause and rest cycle then the cool down. Fully charged, your battery should have higher indication. You will need an " amp clamp" that reads DC current. A stand alone model or an add on that plugs into your multimeter. Good luck.

 

[GoToGuy]

I'd have to look it up, but if i remember correctly it states 30 seconds starter 30 seconds off, 1 minute off, 30 seconds starter, 1 minute off, 30 seconds starter, then 5 minutes off. I haven't had this kind of test in while so i would check the book. But that was the starter duty cycle. You see why the pause and rest cycle then the cool down. Fully charged, your battery should have higher indication. You will need an " amp clamp" that reads DC current. A stand alone model or an add on that plugs into your multimeter. Good luck.

Correction- 30 on, 1 min off, 30 on, 1 min off, 30 on, then 5 minutes off.

 

[Erik the Awful]

'm trying to determine if the "testing" was worth two squirts of duck poop.

I just got a mental image of someone squeezing a duck to get two squirts of duck poop, and it made me chuckle too much.

 

[Schurkey]

I just got a mental image of someone squeezing a duck to get two squirts of duck poop, and it made me chuckle too much.

Admission: that phrase was shamelessly stolen from Cliff Ruggles, the Q-Jet guru.




Thousands and thousands of years ago, I was taught by The Master how to diagnose the "Starting/Charging Power Team" at a well-known Mass Merchandizer that happened to have an "Auto Center" along one side of the building. We sold and installed thousands of batteries, starters, alternators; and EVERY vehicle that got that sort of electrical work, got On-The-Car testing of battery condition, alternator output, and starter condition. At that point, the Sun VAT-40 volt-ohm-ammeter-load pile was the industry standard.

Now, I think the only folks who test those components are the parts stores; it's all "off-the-car" and it's nearly useless for fixing a vehicle. It's fast and efficient for determining if the new part you're being sold is "factory defective". Whether the new part they're selling you will fix your vehicle is still a guessing-game.

 

[92Landyacht]

This may be a long shot, but is it possible that you have a leaking injector and there's a small amount of fuel in a cylinder on initial crank. Kind of like a partial hydrolock.