Need help '97 vortec - Edelbrock Power package top end

Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. If you click them and make a purchase, we may earn a small commission.

michael hurd

Stalker be gone.
Joined
Jul 30, 2012
Messages
1,876
Reaction score
603
are there tuning complications - 96-00 SB to BB with the oem black box?

It literally depends on what exactly you plan on doing. If you are dropping in a complete, stock Vortec era BB with the factory injection and the factory wiring harness and all of the sensors for that engine, then it's a simple matter of flashing the computer with the appropriate tables in the engine portion. Once you have a baseline, you can have the computer tuned for the application.

Please note the 4L60E will not withstand any amount of abuse stock, and a big block, even stock is over it's torque rating.

Yes, you could technically use the 4L60E without any modification, but it will not live a long and healthy life. 4L80E is a stronger transmission in stock form. The tables for the transmission are different for the 4L80E than the 4L60E, requiring a sector swap in the computer.


I was under the assumption that if you are talking swap to the big block, you still want to run an aftermarket EFI unit with their own computer. If you plan on doing that, the stock computer is basically useless.

Main point is if you want to make 400+ hp and 400+ ft lbs, you should plan on upgrading the transmission as well, no matter what the engine you plan on putting in front of it.
 

Vodka0tter

I'm Awesome
Joined
Oct 4, 2016
Messages
153
Reaction score
62
Location
Kansas City
Yes, trans is part of the budget if I add much HP regardless of the mill. Looks like the BB has more options on the intake side. If I consider an l19 or l29 I would most likely stick with stock heads with light clean up work and a bit more cam. I saw the BB heads flow more on exhaust than intake and actually need some back pressure. Interesting...
 

Dubs

I'm Awesome
Joined
Nov 14, 2016
Messages
714
Reaction score
715
Location
Clearwater FL
Vodka, what is your budget and what are you really looking to do? That would probably help everyone in sharing what to do. Also, what year is the vehicle it's going in? I know you have a 97 Vortec but is the truck a 96+ also?
 

Vodka0tter

I'm Awesome
Joined
Oct 4, 2016
Messages
153
Reaction score
62
Location
Kansas City
oh - right. Guess that would help...

OK - its a '97 RCSB. I picked it up on a whim from a guy who got it in an estate sale and began to fiddle around with it - no real plans. It has 350k on it but is in very good shape. Full records since day one! The motor and trans were re-built and are fine, each have ~ 70k now. Gutted the interior and put power leather in, built a console, nav & Sub bla bla... put a Moog front end on with new rotors and calipers along with a rear disc brake conversion. E-fan and some general replacement items too (PS pump, U-joints etc) The body is is great shape but I'll be stripping and painting it this summer. I'll post up some pics this weekend.

Any way - it runs fine, well fine for a vortec. Just want some more ponies on the pedal. I plan on putting 8k in the engine and trans. Could go higher but would prefer lower - 5ish would be good. Hence the top end attempt... I will need to do exhaust work as well. I'd like to put out somewhere in the 400+/- HP range.

It may be a DD in the summer, may end up sitting more than running, may end up selling it if I get too damn frustrated getting some power. Depends on where I go with it.

My experience has been mostly with old school SB Chevy. I am 55 and have played with alot of Novas, chevells, trucks, harleys, build a V8 CJ5 and a 350 powered Pinto (lol). Only real modern work I have done is with an '05 Ram which I did heads, cam some trans/suspension and a fair dose of progressive spray. Got the full size 4x4 into the 11's. Very un-knowledgeable with this era Chevy but learning.
 

michael hurd

Stalker be gone.
Joined
Jul 30, 2012
Messages
1,876
Reaction score
603
With an 8 grand budget for both engine and transmission that's going to be tight. A quality exhaust system can cost you upwards of a grand with headers, depending on how much fabrication you can do.

Yes, you can re-work the stock cylinder heads, but the price per performance drops quickly when you need to either pin the rocker studs or remove the press in studs, drill and tap for thread in rocker studs, open up the push rod holes, re-surface them, cut down the guide diameter and height, install PC type valve stem seals, etc, etc.

Edelbrock Etec 170's are a better head out of the box than the stock heads. Manganese bronze guides, thick decks, decent flow.

The stock bottom end, if in good shape can make more power, given more camshaft and cylinder head flow. Before anything else, do a compression test and a leak down test.

What I suggest as a recipe: Stock bottom end, fresh set of bearings if you feel the need. Install a set of Etec170's, the 200's will lose torque everywhere and some hp, if you had 383+ inches, they would be a better choice.

Camshaft: that depends on your tire size, overall vehicle weight, gearing, and transmission choice. Call a couple cam companies and see what they will recommend given your engine displacement, tire size, gearing, intended use, etc. The biggest I would suggest would be the LT4 hot cam... and even then, it may be too much to give you a decent idle and enough vacuum for reliable brakes. Assuming the lifters are serviceable, re-use them. Going too large on the camshaft is the worst thing you can do for power.

Rockers: if you have the bucks, Crower has 1.7, 1.8 and up to 1.85 - 1 ratio rockers for the SBC, must use 7/16 studs. You will have to use pushrod guide plates with them, but I am not sure what the Etec 170 has for stud diameter.

Of course, if you want to use these large ratio rocker arms ( instead of the factory 1.5 ), they can transform even the wimpy stock L31 camshaft into .511 lift intake and .528 lift exhaust, and add duration. Going to need to purchase a pushrod length checker and check geometry, and order the appropriate length pushrods.

Port flow tapers off around .500" anyways, so duration is about the best thing you can add after lift is in that area, but too much is not a good thing. It's all about area 'under the curve', if you want airflow.

Intake: Port the lower intake, there is gains to be had, especially around the mounting for the spider. A V-max manifold spacer kit will also give you great gains in the amount of airflow around the spider. If your poppets or MPFI spider is serviceable, no need to replace it.

Exhaust: A quality set of long tube headers with 1 5/8 or 1 3/4 primaries. The longer the better. Pacesetter makes a nice drop in set of long tubes for these trucks. Dual 2.5" pipes with an X pipe as close to the rear of the transmission as possible.

Transmission: local builder, good quality parts. Keep the stock 4l60E transmission. If pressure test is OK, no need to put a pump in it. Change all of the clutch material out for high friction units. Best get a new sun reaction shell, 97+ GM OE are decent, but there are others as well. Trans go HD2 kit, larger servos for more holding power. Put in a new set of A and B solenoids at the same time. Sonnax makes some good parts, and they have a tech section on their website.

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

A worked over L31 with the above will not be a bear to tune, drive, or deal with on a daily basis. Keep the factory intake and black box, it's your least expensive option, but have someone like Black Bear performance tune it for you.
 

Vodka0tter

I'm Awesome
Joined
Oct 4, 2016
Messages
153
Reaction score
62
Location
Kansas City
good stuff, thanks again michael. Looking around for a marine intake. If i can find one I may go that route. I pulled the intake apart last night - what a flow nightmare in there. It really all hinges on what I can find/do with the intake.

Thoughts on Edelbrock LT1/4 airgap and performer LT1 heads? http://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/7107K3/10002/-1. Tuning issues?
 

michael hurd

Stalker be gone.
Joined
Jul 30, 2012
Messages
1,876
Reaction score
603
No need to fix what isn't broke.

Don't forget the intake is only required to flow air, and not fuel, nor keep fuel in suspension.
 

michael hurd

Stalker be gone.
Joined
Jul 30, 2012
Messages
1,876
Reaction score
603
Porting the lower intake, adding a Vmax spacer to move the upper intake higher, allows more airflow without costing you an arm and a leg.
 

Vodka0tter

I'm Awesome
Joined
Oct 4, 2016
Messages
153
Reaction score
62
Location
Kansas City
gottcha. Again - I really appreciate the insight! Guess a bit of quality dremel time can help as well.

Doing a compression/leak down test today. See what we have...
 

michael hurd

Stalker be gone.
Joined
Jul 30, 2012
Messages
1,876
Reaction score
603
Dremel isn't going to cut the mustard. I spent about 12 hours in one with air powered die grinders at work after hours. If you intend to do any serious porting, an electric cable driven tool is the only thing to use. A lot of the work went into the mount for the spider, I cut it down extensively.

The compressor at work is a large industrial unit, so I wasn't overheating it, it had more capacity than needed.
 
Top