My opinion of the "free" or "cheap" tbi mods

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vic_v8

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I figured after 14 years of having different TBI trucks and Camaros, I'd share some of my experiences. The stickies are great, but sometimes people only having one TBI to gauge from, isn't much of a control.

In no way am I a TBI expert, this is just in my personal experiences:

Free Mods (or at least very inexpensive)

1. Get rid of the air cleaner spacer ring (plenty of threads on this)
2. SeaFoam (or GM Top Engine cleaner) the engine, both through the booster hose, and letting soak through the TBI. People don't believe how much difference a dirty intake and combustion chamber make restoring power and MPG.
3. Full tune up (not free but needs to be done). Cap, rotor, wires, plugs, fuel filter, and if the coil and o2 sensor look old or have a ton of miles. Mods are pointless if you don't have good solid base line.
4. Set base timing to 4* (some will argue this, but I've seen a dyno run showing it did something)
5. Open Element cleaner (or take the heat flapper out of the stock one if you prefer the snorkel set up)
6. Shave the horns of the TBI unit (sticky up top), injector pod spacer or double stack 2 gaskets and spend $1 at the hardware store for longer screws (M5 .80 pitch 20 length)
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7. TBI Spacer
8. If for some reason you need to take the intake off, gasket match it, the heads (or at least the HD tbi heads I have) match up pretty good, but the intake didn't.
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I have seen (a long time ago) were these "free" mods are worth about 10 hp on a dyno. They'll feel like a lot more if you are in need of some maintenance.

Next would be mods that cost a little more, results and cost based on what you want:

1. Exhaust. I have never swapped to headers on a TBI truck, but on my Camaro they helped a lot. Probably not the same on a truck.
2. Carb dual plane intake with adapter (which will act as a spacer)
3. Cam, personally I like the LT1 cam and swapping to roller lifters (all junk yard parts) or you could do 1.6 Roller Rocks as a way to get a little more out of the stock cam.
4. Heads
5. Gears

Obviously you'll have to change more if you go farther (bigger TBI, etc)

Depending where you stop on the list, I spent $400 about 8 years ago to do all my own data logging and chip burning, not sure of prices today. I've seen some good chips being worth 10-25 hp depending on set up.

If you are looking to get more than 300 hp out of the TBI for cheap, you should look past it and go LS swap. My 88 V2500 has about 330 hp and the swap was $2000 (prices will vary depending on your deals)

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vic_v8

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Forgot my all time favorite cheap mod for a little power and MPG because it comes stock on a Camaro/Firebird.

Electric fans. They usually add .5 mpg and if you have a manual trans truck, you can definitely tell a difference while shifting.

With the just half of the "free" mods and cat back, I took my Camaro from a 16.8 1/4 to a 15.6. With headers, cat delete, dead weight delete (about 50 lbs), 2.73 to 3.42 I went down to 14.4. Looking for 11.9 with LS swap.
 

phule

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That burban looks awesome the the h2s

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someotherguy

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4. Set base timing to 4* (some will argue this, but I've seen a dyno run showing it did something)

5. Open Element cleaner (or take the heat flapper out of the stock one if you prefer the snorkel set up)

7. TBI Spacer

I have seen (a long time ago) were these "free" mods are worth about 10 hp on a dyno. They'll feel like a lot more if you are in need of some maintenance.
4. After graphing data with the timing bumped only 2° BTDC I've seen knock counts and corresponding knock retard, enough to convince me that I was wrong to recommend bumping timing to anyone. Since then I run my TBI small blocks at 0° factory spec.

5. Why open element air cleaner? I agree; remove the heat riser flap. But keep that factory cold air intake the trucks come with. It's free.

7. Why TBI spacer? Negligible / questionable gains for a bunch of hassle and potential for more base gasket leaks, fuel line fitment issues, problems with throttle cable angle and more importantly, on 700R4/4L60 transmissions - throttle valve cable angle and adjustment issues.

10 HP could easily be explained away by simple variance from one dyno run to the next. I wouldn't bank on small gains like that unless you could repeat it over, and over, and over without question. Then you have to ask yourself if those dyno gains transfer to real-world driving conditions.

I'm not saying these things to argue with you; just offering a difference of opinion backed up with my experiences. I'm saying that the beauty of a TBI is that they are rock-solid simple and will run reliably forever as long as you don't jack with them. I've seen a lot of people attempting to do the simple mods to their TBI's and end up with less than useful results.

If you want more power, time to look elsewhere. Like the LS swap you did. :)

Richard
 

thunderstruck

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4. After graphing data with the timing bumped only 2° BTDC I've seen knock counts and corresponding knock retard, enough to convince me that I was wrong to recommend bumping timing to anyone. Since then I run my TBI small blocks at 0° factory spec.

7. Why TBI spacer? Negligible / questionable gains for a bunch of hassle and potential for more base gasket leaks, fuel line fitment issues, problems with throttle cable angle and more importantly, on 700R4/4L60 transmissions - throttle valve cable angle and adjustment issues.

10 HP could easily be explained away by simple variance from one dyno run to the next. I wouldn't bank on small gains like that unless you could repeat it over, and over, and over without question. Then you have to ask yourself if those dyno gains transfer to real-world driving conditions.

I'm not saying these things to argue with you; just offering a difference of opinion backed up with my experiences. I'm saying that the beauty of a TBI is that they are rock-solid simple and will run reliably forever as long as you don't jack with them. I've seen a lot of people attempting to do the simple mods to their TBI's and end up with less than useful results.

If you want more power, time to look elsewhere. Like the LS swap you did. :)

Richard

Agreed.
 

skylark

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4. After graphing data with the timing bumped only 2° BTDC I've seen knock counts and corresponding knock retard, enough to convince me that I was wrong to recommend bumping timing to anyone. Since then I run my TBI small blocks at 0° factory spec.

5. Why open element air cleaner? I agree; remove the heat riser flap. But keep that factory cold air intake the trucks come with. It's free.

7. Why TBI spacer? Negligible / questionable gains for a bunch of hassle and potential for more base gasket leaks, fuel line fitment issues, problems with throttle cable angle and more importantly, on 700R4/4L60 transmissions - throttle valve cable angle and adjustment issues.

10 HP could easily be explained away by simple variance from one dyno run to the next. I wouldn't bank on small gains like that unless you could repeat it over, and over, and over without question. Then you have to ask yourself if those dyno gains transfer to real-world driving conditions.

I'm not saying these things to argue with you; just offering a difference of opinion backed up with my experiences. I'm saying that the beauty of a TBI is that they are rock-solid simple and will run reliably forever as long as you don't jack with them. I've seen a lot of people attempting to do the simple mods to their TBI's and end up with less than useful results.

If you want more power, time to look elsewhere. Like the LS swap you did. :)

Richard

I will only argue with you on one modified point. Vortec long block using tbi works very well at 4 degrees.
 
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I'm running 8*on my 94 and she runs like a ***** ape. I've got the tb spacer, injector spacer, headers and cai and at 0* she's a dog.
 

someotherguy

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I'm sorry, did you just say a TBI runs like a ***** ape?

Maybe you've never driven anything truly powerful to compare to. :)

Richard
 
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