Rear Axle Lift-SOLVED-

Discussion in 'Full Custom Suspension / Cages / Fab' started by Pighuntin, Jul 9, 2018.

  1. Pighuntin

    Pighuntin Newbie

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    First time posting. I am Pig, pleased to meet everyone. A bit about me....From Albuquerque, land of Off-road. I am an ASE Master Cert tech. So.....if you are technical....I will get it. Being a Master tech does NOT mean I am 100% with fab work. Thats where this question is gonna lie.

    The Truck. 1988 C1500. Standard cab long fleet side. 350 with 700R4(for the moment). Now.....The only relevant info to this is the rear suspension. Now I have owned this truck for 15 years. Done damn near everything on this truck. In any case, I used this truck for hog hunting. Put about 6 hogs in the bed....truck squatted horribly. So....I just added 2 leafs in the rear. Picked that truck right up and increased the payload to 4000lbs+. I am very happy with the spring rates, compression and load caps.

    Now....3 years ago....1 among the MANY wrecks this truck has been involved in was a 4x4 Ford van that ended up passing me on the right and rolling into the right front wheel. This wreck ended up peeling up the upper control arm mounts off the frame a bit. I sledged them down and then welded them. Took it off road, cruised about 60mph, hit the worst bump(and believe me....it was bad) and stopped. The weld held. So....Continued using the truck. The way I welded the bracket, I couldnt get the camber right. Was eating tires left and right. 33x12.5x15.....They aint cheap. So...I decided to move on a plan that I started 7 years ago. A full driveline and SAS swap.

    Now....after no help with the front, I finally got the front axle in and locked in. I have the rear axle out. I am gonna be using the rear leafs. So there is NO option to replace them. I know their rates too well. I have the rear leafs just hanging out in the breeze. Rear shackles are off the truck. The stock beginning heights of this truck before the work was 34" in the front and 37" in the rear. Now my front is 45". This is the lowest I can get with the frame mods. So...I need at least a 12" lift in the back. The question to this epic is this.....How can I get the rear leaf springs down far enough without creating something that will have alot of flex? I will NOT use lifting blocks. So eliminate that idea altogether. No axle wrap here ever. The furthest shackle flips that bolt on I can find are 6". Longer shackles create issues as well.

    Whats the best approach?
     
  2. magimerlin

    magimerlin I'm Awesome

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    So you want to make the front to back rake even more? That's what an "at least 12" lift in the back" will do... lifted that high with a rake I think would look kinda funny. The rear before was already 3" higher than the before solid axle front. With looking for 12" at least in the rear after the SAS you are looking at 4"+ higher than the front. That's a huge differance. Most trucks with that much lift typically just making the front and back level to each other, or with in an inch or so. that would mean you only need 8" of lift in the rear.

    All up to you and your prefferance though.. but if you really want the 12+ in the back.... you will have to do the flip kit and fab new front hangers that will drop the spring mounting location down lower. But the stuff hanger that much lower defeats the purpose of lifting it ...

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk
     
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  3. Pighuntin

    Pighuntin Newbie

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    This comment has been deleted to remove in progress pics of the truck. While the pics were vague in detail, I do not want to share what little detail there was.

    As stated by a member, this type of build is well documented and therefore my pics are not needed on this thread any longer.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2018 at 11:54 PM
  4. strikk

    strikk I'm Awesome

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    Various companies sell a “shackle flip” for the rear of these 88-98 trucks. Off-road designs, diy4x, WFO. Concepts for a short list. Check out all of their designs and you could go with something similar to fit your height requirement.

    All of those shackle flips are roughly 4” lift by design and then people use a HD shackle also produced by those same companies that gives up to another 6” inches of lift. You could fab up something similar or if you could scratch up $200 you could buy the parts.


    WFO $200: http://www.wfoconcepts.com/pr/Shackle-Flip-Chevy-Truck-1-2-Ton-88-98/3460/3475
    ORD $167: http://www.offroaddesign.com/catalog/shacklekit.htm
    DIY 4x $208 Painted with shackles: https://diy4x.com/product.php?productid=17733&cat=250&page=3
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2018
  5. RichLo

    RichLo I'm Awesome

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    Dont forget to adjust pinion angle also when you go that high.
     
  6. Pighuntin

    Pighuntin Newbie

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    @strikk......None of those kits get me high enough. 6" is half of what I need.

    @RichLo....I know. I dont have an axle on the truck at the moment to worry about pinion angle.

    Need better ideas please.
     
  7. aaronb

    aaronb I'm Awesome

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    This is my old stepside with around 11" front and 10" in the rear. It was on 40's when I sold it. If I remember right, my fenders measured front around 50.5" and rear was around 50".
    I didn't do a shackle flip, it was a 10" leaf spring.
    What strikk posted is what you are going to want for the rear, or you are going to have a massive difference in ride height front to back if you think you need 12" in the rear to be level with the front.

    20170730_110233.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2018
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  8. Biggershaft96

    Biggershaft96 Cant Getrite

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    those were both solid ideas. If your looking for a bolt in kit for 12” of lift your never going to get it done, plain and simple. So use your brain, a 6” shackle flip and a 6” lift spring is 12” of lift.

    Also RichLo didnt say anything about having an axle under it now, he said when you go that high your going to have to adjust the pinion angle. And he is right. Your gonna have to take that into account bc you gonna have to order shims or a tapered block when you order springs. On top of that your stock driveshaft isnt going to work with that much lift.

    Something tells me you havnt thought this build through very well
     
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  9. Pighuntin

    Pighuntin Newbie

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    @Biggershaft96......Ok.....I thought I made it clear in my previous posts what I wanted. Obviously since you want to tell me that I am not thinking things through and solid ideas that go AGAINST what I want in an end product....yea.....obviously my 7 years planning and obtaining parts is not well thought out. You offered NO assistance and now are resorting to an online pissing match instead telling me I have no idea what I am doing. This is the second question about the build I have had and the first one just like you, resulted in NO answers and instead resorted to a belittling rant.

    The reason I do NOT want to go to new springs is cause my load capacity will be LESS. The rear springs I have built.....carry the load and trailer WITHOUT squatting. I have increased the spring rating DOUBLE. Now using that 10" spring puts my load capacity to LESS that what the truck was stock. So a 6" shackle flip is NOT gonna get what I need done. The only reason I ask this is cause the front went up a bit higher than I was wanting. Its at the edge of tearing the front down and starting over.

    Now....you want to babble something about lift blocks....NO. Last thing I want with a loaded down truck is axle wrap.

    While you want to say nothing was thought out....this truck is very well thought out and I was expecting around an 8" lift to the front. The plan was a shackle flip with maybe some longer shackles. The front went in with no issues in measurements or angles of the diff or leafs. The question I had about that was about the shackle angle. I guess that was poor planning too, right?

    I was told that the only dumb questions were questions NOT asked. I ask out of the box questions, I get bolt on in the box answers. While my fab skills are not the best out there, it seems that I am probably the ONLY real fabber here.

    And since I have obviously no idea what I am doing about this build, tell everyone here what should be done and how much of someone elses money should be spent? Should everything be bolt on? No welding ever? Are you afraid to think out of the box? Does the idea someone with more fabbing skills looking for solid ideas scare you? I mean you have to had a reason to tell me I know nothing of what I am doing despite being an ASE tech of over 20 years.

    Before you go off telling someone you dont even know that they know nothing, I would suggest heavily reading the previous posts. They contain alot of information of what I want in an end product. Telling people they know nothing is never a smart move unless you have 100% irrefutable evidence of it, keep your gawddamn flipping trap shut. Cause right now, the only one that knows nothing is you. And thats verified by your comments and mine.


    For the driveshaft.....again....read....please PLEASE read....2WD to 4WD. NO DUH I am gonna need a new driveshaft. Are you gonna tell me I need a driveshaft too for the front? Cause I never EVER once thought of that. Also....the transfer case is a yolk....will my slip in driveshaft work too?! Cause it looks like it may. And again....I have leafs....I know the pinion angles need to done. I have an axle for the truck....its NOT under it cause there are NO mounts for the leafs. So why install a diff thats just gonna be laying on the ground?

    See....you are taking talking points from people who are NOT at the steps I am at. You neglected EVERYTHING in my previous posts and came up with the drivel you did.

    So......the question. THE ONLY QUESTION......How can I bring the shackles down 12 inches WITHOUT buying a weaker spring? This is a WORK truck that sees more offroad use than road use. I regularly carry 3000+ lbs in it plus the trailer. And mind you.....this is in a 2WD configuration. I am opting for 4WD cause I am getting deeper into the country my truck is not supposed to be going into. So....is this in ANY way unclear to you? I dont give a flip about what you think about driveshafts, pinion angles, tires or even the lightbulbs I plan on using. I just want to hear out of the box ideas from people who know how to actually fabricate something without having to buy it, grind a rivet or two and say. "yea....I fabbed that".

    Customization is all about thinking outside the box.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2018
  10. NightRunner

    NightRunner Supporting Member

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    Acting hostile over one comment isn't going to win you any friends on this board. It's the internet, if you can't take criticism without going on a long winded rant about how everyone else is dumb, tried and true bolt on modifications are ridiculous, not a single person on this board has any custom fabrication skills whatsoever, and reiterating your question again hoping for someone to be kind enough to answer your question for you, you probably shouldn't be on the internet in general. Biggershaft has helped me out with my dumb questions, as well as others on this forum (not saying your question in particular is dumb, don't take that the wrong way and write me a 3 page essay). Lots of great people with good advice to give. Plus, to my understanding just swapping the springs themselves won't safely double the towing capacity (maybe the spring rate but you're still limited to what you can tow because of the 1/2 ton frame itself). Lots of things to take into consideration.

    But what do I know? I'm just a dumb ghetto kid with no experience in vehicles, fabrication, or anything of the nature. My opinion doesn't matter, right?
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2018

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