Panel Bonding?

[AK 99]

Let me rephrase that...

When used properly, it is just as strong as welding when used on a modern vehicle with very thin gauge sheetmetal.

 

[Hipster]

The 3M panel bond was never meant to hold an entire structural panel without any welding. People evidently just did it anyway because they actually did think it was miracle glue.

Using an average car quarter panel as an example, you should still weld the seam at the sail panel, the seam at the rocker panel and also along where the quarter meets the rear body panel. But every situation is different and has it's own requirements. When used properly it is just as strong as welding. I've had enough repeat customers that obviously can't drive too well to see for myself that it's true.

If you're in the repair business then you know the Insurance companies want the vehicles repaired according to oem guidelines. Repaired to pre accident condition and all that jazz. Every manufacture has guidelines and they are available on All Data. Gluing over the wheelhouse as a sole means which was once acceptable no longer is. It's not how they were built and it's not in any oem repair procedure I've ever seen. I have fixed a bunch the way you describe years ago and never had an issue but if a vehicle you fix that way ends up in another shop for a reinspect you can find yourself paying for the repairs or pursued for diminished value of the vehicle. If you hold I-car certifications you should know better.

 

[AK 99]

If you're in the repair business then you know the Insurance companies want the vehicles repaired according to oem guidelines. Repaired to pre accident condition and all that jazz. Every manufacture has guidelines and they are available on All Data. Gluing over the wheelhouse as a sole means which was once acceptable no longer is. It's not how they were built and it's not in any oem repair procedure I've ever seen. I have fixed a bunch the way you describe years ago and never had an issue but if a vehicle you fix that way ends up in another shop for a reinspect you can find yourself paying for the repairs or pursued for diminished value of the vehicle. If you hold I-car certifications you should know better.

I have been out of the professional business for 7 or 8 years now. I guess that I shouldn't be surprised regulations are still tightening due to all the lawsuit happy folks that want anyone but themselves to be responsible. But as far as the insurance companies go, most of them I had to fight with because they wanted to go the cheap route with improper repairs.

But anyway, it seems we've went down a rabbit hole, lol. We can all agree that installing cab corner patch panels with panel bond and proper prep work is a fine way to go, correct?

 

[Hipster]

I have been out of the professional business for 7 or 8 years now. I guess that I shouldn't be surprised regulations are still tightening due to all the lawsuit happy folks that want anyone but themselves to be responsible. But as far as the insurance companies go, most of them I had to fight with because they wanted to go the cheap route with improper repairs.

But anyway, it seems we've went down a rabbit hole, lol. We can all agree that installing cab corner patch panels with panel bond and proper prep work is a fine way to go, correct?

Yeah , probably fine, not how I would do it but ok. lol

Yeah, the industry has really become about liability and the shops and techs protecting themselves. What used to be a bumper job now involves a $500-700 calibration to aim the autonomous braking sensors so they don't pick up the bridge overpass and slam the brakes on if the sensors got bumped or R&I'd. It's getting more and more technical.

The blame is always placed elsewhere including on the last guy that worked on it.

 

[454cid]

Yeah , probably fine, not how I would do it but ok. lol

Yeah, the industry has really become about liability and the shops and techs protecting themselves. What used to be a bumper job now involves a $500-700 calibration to aim the autonomous braking sensors so they don't pick up the bridge overpass and slam the brakes on if the sensors got bumped or R&I'd. It's getting more and more technical.

The blame is always placed elsewhere including on the last guy that worked on it.

Just great, that means vehicles are getting more disposable :-/

 

[Hipster]

Just great, that means vehicles are getting more disposable :-/

Yes they are, a lot of 2 year old cars total for the cost to repair some of these systems.

 

[454cid]

Yes they are, a lot of 2 year old cars total for the cost to repair some of these systems.

I did that years ago. My 04 Malibu got totaled by my insurance company in 06 after hitting a deer. I'd probably still have that car if not for that. I could not get the insurance company to fix it. Only after it was done, did I find out that my claim had been passed off to a total loss adjuster.... all he did were totals, it was like asking a timber cutter to prune a tree. The guy was slimy too.... always acting like he was helping me out when he was robbing me by devaluing my car. Thankfully, I was not upside down on it.

 

[Kustombuilt1911]

I'm with Hipster on this 1...it'll work, but not the way I'd go about it. I'm on the other end of the spectrum. Deal mostly with higher end street rod/custom stuff. With as much time put into some of these builds an extra few hours with a welder/grinder makes for a better longer lasting fix. With the cost of materials (primers, basecoats, & clears) only going up I don't want 2 take the chance.

 

[Hipster]

I did that years ago. My 04 Malibu got totaled by my insurance company in 06 after hitting a deer. I'd probably still have that car if not for that. I could not get the insurance company to fix it. Only after it was done, did I find out that my claim had been passed off to a total loss adjuster.... all he did were totals, it was like asking a timber cutter to prune a tree. The guy was slimy too.... always acting like he was helping me out when he was robbing me by devaluing my car. Thankfully, I was not upside down on it.

They weigh out all the options, condition of the car , wore out tires, if the interior is trashed, how much other damage is on the car, how much the rental you might be in is going to cost while your car is fixed even though they're not supposed to factor in rentals against the value it does get looked at. A 2 year old car with 50k on it is high mileage. I do know they use something besides NADA to value the cars. More like what those cars actually sold for as a used car in your area instead of an asking price.

Somewhere along the lines someone determined the repairs exceeded the value and sometimes the customer gets a courtesy total.

 

[Hipster]

I'm with Hipster on this 1...it'll work, but not the way I'd go about it. I'm on the other end of the spectrum. Deal mostly with higher end street rod/custom stuff. With as much time put into some of these builds an extra few hours with a welder/grinder makes for a better longer lasting fix. With the cost of materials (primers, basecoats, & clears) only going up I don't want 2 take the chance.

I do some resto stuff but mostly been collision. Paid on commission so I hear ya.

Re-do's and come backs cost you three times. The first time, labor and materials, the second time labor and materials, the third time the job you could have been doing instead of the come-back.

Some basecoat colors are in excess of $150 a quart plus about $100 a quart for a decent clear. If you have to do it a second time you would have saved money not taken on the job, set on the couch doing nothing and still had money left over for a T-bone and a 6 pack.

So if some thing bites me on the rear I never use it again.

After you show the Fusor rep the prep was done properly the next thing he was trained to say is " You used stale dated product" I didn't do the job in question but I didn't think he was going to make it out of the shop under his own power that day! lol