Oil Pan Gasket and Timing Set

[User_name]

Thanks man ! Yeah im keeping it stock.
Should I replace the oil pump at 220k or just leave it alone? Oil pressure was normal, 20 psi at hot idle, 40 psi driving.

Yes, go ahead and replace the oil pump. You're already that far into it and you'll likely see a bump up in oil pressure. You can get a decent melling pump for ~$60 or the gm pump will run close to $100.

 

[Schurkey]

You can get a decent melling pump for ~$60 or the gm pump will run close to $100.

And the GM pump will be made by...Melling.

The big downside of the GM pump, and the inexpensive, common Melling pumps intended for small-blocks, is that GM demanded a weight reduction of the iron casting. Those pumps crack and fail in "motorsports" use. I think the fragile pump is M-55, but not totally sure.

Melling sells "higher performance" SBC pumps that still have the older, stronger casting. In fact, Melling has such a variety of SBC oil pumps that it kinda boggles the mind. Regular volume, high-volume, mid-volume, high pressure, regular pressure, aluminum housing, machined for "full-race" "anti-cavitation/pressure balance" grooves, "standard" straight spur gears, helical "shark tooth" gears, 5/8" or 3/4" pickup tubes...you name it.





The last SBC oil pump I bought, was the M-99HV-S pump "kit" which includes a pump, oil pickup tube/screen, and a steel-sleeve pump driveshaft. I've never used this pump before in a SBC, so it's going to be something of an experiment for me. The pump is a standard M-77 BBC unit with an 8" BBC pickup tube, but sold as fitting the "302" SBC. Due to the differences in the BBC vs. SBC oil pump design, it will require modifications to the windage trays in Vortec and perhaps TBI engines (I think they use the same windage trays.)

This is supposedly "too much" oil pump for a SBC. My intention is to use the lowest-pressure spring in the pressure regulator; high-volume but low pressure; with the added benefit of smoother operation due to more "gear teeth" than the standard and high-volume SBC pumps.

www.summitracing.com/parts/mel-m99hvs

Melling M-99HV-S Melling High-Volume Oil Pumps | Summit Racing

Free Shipping - Melling High-Volume Oil Pumps with qualifying orders of $109. Shop Oil Pumps at Summit Racing.

www.summitracing.com

 

[L31MaxExpress]

And the GM pump will be made by...Melling.

The big downside of the GM pump, and the inexpensive, common Melling pumps intended for small-blocks, is that GM demanded a weight reduction of the iron casting. Those pumps crack and fail in "motorsports" use. I think the fragile pump is M-55, but not totally sure.

Melling sells "higher performance" SBC pumps that still have the older, stronger casting. In fact, Melling has such a variety of SBC oil pumps that it kinda boggles the mind. Regular volume, high-volume, mid-volume, high pressure, regular pressure, aluminum housing, machined for "full-race" "anti-cavitation/pressure balance" grooves, "standard" straight spur gears, helical "shark tooth" gears, 5/8" or 3/4" pickup tubes...you name it.





The last SBC oil pump I bought, was the M-99HV-S pump "kit" which includes a pump, oil pickup tube/screen, and a steel-sleeve pump driveshaft. I've never used this pump before in a SBC, so it's going to be something of an experiment for me. The pump is a standard M-77 BBC unit with an 8" BBC pickup tube, but sold as fitting the "302" SBC. Due to the differences in the BBC vs. SBC oil pump design, it will require modifications to the windage trays in Vortec and perhaps TBI engines (I think they use the same windage trays.)

This is supposedly "too much" oil pump for a SBC. My intention is to use the lowest-pressure spring in the pressure regulator; high-volume but low pressure; with the added benefit of smoother operation due to more "gear teeth" than the standard and high-volume SBC pumps.

www.summitracing.com/parts/mel-m99hvs

Melling M-99HV-S Melling High-Volume Oil Pumps | Summit Racing

Free Shipping - Melling High-Volume Oil Pumps with qualifying orders of $109. Shop Oil Pumps at Summit Racing.

www.summitracing.com

I run the same pump (383 has a M-77 since I used an 8.25" bolt-on pickup to match the pan requirements); I use a Melling factory L88 replacement spring. In fact, that is the only pump I have used in the last 6 small blocks I have built. The windage tray modification is very slight and I performed it with a carbide cutter on an air grinder. Outside of the shop, away from the engine I was building. Then washed the tray to get off the metal shrapnel before it even came close to the engine. I washed it about 3-4 times and test fitted it each time. Grab an ARP oil pump stud while you are at it. I prefer the stud to a bolt that can easily be too long and distort the rear main bearing. With the engine fully heat soaked running 5w30, I see 25 psi at 750 rpm, 40 psi at 2,000 rpm, and 70 psi above about 3,000 rpm. Bypass opens at 70 PSI. With 5w20, deduct 5 psi off the 750 and 2,000 rpm readings with 5w30. With 10w30 add 5 psi to the 750 and 2,000 rpm readings with 5w30. With all 3 oils, 70 psi was achieved around 3,000 rpm. I am at a loss as to why 5w30 vs 10w30 makes a hot oil pressure difference but it definately seems to be consistent.

I have settled in on running 10w30 Mobil One, the engine is quieter all around with it and it makes an even bigger difference at cold start. It is a fairly noisy engine mechanically. Forged pistons, Rhoads V-Max Lifters, 1.7 roller rockers, fairly aggressive lobes on the roller cam all add to the sewing machine of mechanical symphony. The forged pistons in the engine require extra piston to bore clearance by design. Without the more viscous oil it has more noticeable piston slap when it is cold. Once it is warmed up the noise is the same with all oils as the pistons have expanded in the bores and the added clearance closes up.

 

[User_name]

And the GM pump will be made by...Melling.

The big downside of the GM pump, and the inexpensive, common Melling pumps intended for small-blocks, is that GM demanded a weight reduction of the iron casting. Those pumps crack and fail in "motorsports" use. I think the fragile pump is M-55, but not totally sure.

Melling sells "higher performance" SBC pumps that still have the older, stronger casting. In fact, Melling has such a variety of SBC oil pumps that it kinda boggles the mind. Regular volume, high-volume, mid-volume, high pressure, regular pressure, aluminum housing, machined for "full-race" "anti-cavitation/pressure balance" grooves, "standard" straight spur gears, helical "shark tooth" gears, 5/8" or 3/4" pickup tubes...you name it.





The last SBC oil pump I bought, was the M-99HV-S pump "kit" which includes a pump, oil pickup tube/screen, and a steel-sleeve pump driveshaft. I've never used this pump before in a SBC, so it's going to be something of an experiment for me. The pump is a standard M-77 BBC unit with an 8" BBC pickup tube, but sold as fitting the "302" SBC. Due to the differences in the BBC vs. SBC oil pump design, it will require modifications to the windage trays in Vortec and perhaps TBI engines (I think they use the same windage trays.)

This is supposedly "too much" oil pump for a SBC. My intention is to use the lowest-pressure spring in the pressure regulator; high-volume but low pressure; with the added benefit of smoother operation due to more "gear teeth" than the standard and high-volume SBC pumps.

www.summitracing.com/parts/mel-m99hvs

Melling M-99HV-S Melling High-Volume Oil Pumps | Summit Racing

Free Shipping - Melling High-Volume Oil Pumps with qualifying orders of $109. Shop Oil Pumps at Summit Racing.

www.summitracing.com

For this guys intentions, the stock pump is just fine. That was my reasoning for offering the idea of a stock melling or "gm" pump. Just like I said a few posts earlier with the timing chain, stock should be plenty capable for his application since he's staying pretty close to stock.

 

[L31MaxExpress]

For this guys intentions, the stock pump is just fine. That was my reasoning for offering the idea of a stock melling or "gm" pump. Just like I said a few posts earlier with the timing chain, stock should be plenty capable for his application since he's staying pretty close to stock.

I wouldn't use the stock style 1500 chain in a 267. They are done being accurate in 50K miles. Single roller last practically forever. I also do not like the SBC oil pump, its hard on the distributor drive gear only having 7 teeth. Big block pump turns much more smoothly and does not wear the distributor or cam gear as much. Just observations I have made tearing down 100K mile engines with both setups. With a truck the engine gets lugged down alot and the big block pump provides increased volume and thus pressure at low rpm where the engine needs it most.

 

[User_name]

I wouldn't use the stock style 1500 chain in a 267. They are done being accurate in 50K miles. Single roller last practically forever.

School me. I've never had any issues. But I'd like to know. Because if it can benefit me in the future. I want it.
Does the stock chain just stretch more?

 

[L31MaxExpress]

School me. I've never had any issues. But I'd like to know. Because if it can benefit me in the future. I want it.
Does the stock chain just stretch more?

Stretches more and it eats into the sprockets. You can actually see indentions in the sprockets of the link style chain in under 25K miles. I removed the set out of my GM crate L05 at about 25K when I cammed it with a custom grind Reed cam back in the day that had been chewed on badly. L05 has a limp noodle profile too.

 

[L31MaxExpress]

Obviously more severe wear than I found in mine, but see how the chain eats into the sprockets. On the single roller the rollers smoothly seat into position as the sprockets and chain mesh, eliminating almost all of that wear point.

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[User_name]

Point, and advice taken. Thanks!

 

[97Burban57]

Now im thoroughly confused.
I thought the cloyes 1157 and the 3157 were very good stock replacements?? And after hearing this about the newer thinner oil pumps maybe i should just leave the old 220k stock pump alone.