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TechNova

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So you all are saying I need not be concerned about getting certified. The thickest thing I've welded (outside of a controlled classroom) is a 3/8 steel plate. I was able to get decent penetration using flux core on a 110 mig welder.
no need to be certified for home use. I doubt you had actual penetration on 3/8" steel with 110V unless you had an open butt joint. 110v gets you 140 amps max, 3/8" would need more for single pass full penetration. 3/16" is probably max for 140 amps.
 

thinger2

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That's about the truth right there.

A lot of people think they're good welders until they have their stuff destructive tested or x-rayed. A lot to keep up with welding on cars. I-Car used to call for 30% more plug welds than factory except in crush zones, what is or isn't HSS or SHSS steels, welding close to magnesium parts that should have been removed etc. Proper use of weld-thru primers, the fact some work better than others, and some just contaminate the weld. Cars full of computers that can fry from just one incident of an improper ground, Oem guidelines and sectioning procedures that don't always make sense but that's the way it needs to be done. Improper repair procedures/methods/poor welding can lead to early or late srs deployment etc.

When you get into something that is designed and engineered to collapse at a controlled rate to protect the occupants there's some different rules involved then what might be discussed in a standard sky scraper/ bridge building/pipe-line welding class or cert. Nevermind welding beer can thickness sheetmetal. lol
A standard sky scraper/ bridge building etc...cert aint exactly easy either.
We take two pieces of plate and bevel them and you have to multi pass both sides.
Then we cut that plate into "weld coupons" and put them in a press with a 1.5 inch punch and the ends are going over two rollers as it gets pushed into a "U" shape with the punch part pressing on your weld.
Then we take the next coupon and flip it upside down and do it again.
That assumes you havent been already rejected for visual undercut, porosity, slag inclusions, etc..
And that assumes I havent already busted you for bad setup/ no documentation/ no recording of anything. No weld spec in place .
No preheat record if required etc...
A weld certification has several parts to it.
You have to certify that it is an AWS approved process.
If it isnt, then you need to test and certify that out of bounds process.
Then you need to certify the actual machine settings. Are they welding within the parameters of that certified process.
And you also need to have rock solid documentation for the material that they are welding.
Do you have the "certs"
Is this a bonded material and if so do you have the entire chain of possesion and control for that material.
To pass that very basic basic test your bent coupon can not have any cracks or splits or seperation at all.
None allowed.
And we will test 4 coupons. 2 up, 2 down.
The allowable defect is zero.
All of that is so I will sign off on your 1g cert.
Yep, as a welding inspector you get to sign for it.
And that means that if a structural failure happens from poor welding practices you stand a pretty good chance of being charged with manslaughter.
I know people that have been through that.
I have certified many many people over my career.
I am not certified to inspect pipeline welds or pressure vessel welds.
That is whole different subset of the welding industry.
Welding sheet metal can be difficult.
But in no way is way welding sheet metal anywhere near as difficult and critical and dangerious as structural welding and being an iron worker.
Looky here pal.
Welding a seam on a car isnt easy.
Doing a multi pass back gouge on the 34th floor in winter and making it pass inspection is just maybe a little bit harder to do.
Just maybe.
 

letitsnow

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A standard sky scraper/ bridge building etc...cert aint exactly easy either.
We take two pieces of plate and bevel them and you have to multi pass both sides.
Then we cut that plate into "weld coupons" and put them in a press with a 1.5 inch punch and the ends are going over two rollers as it gets pushed into a "U" shape with the punch part pressing on your weld.
Then we take the next coupon and flip it upside down and do it again.
That assumes you havent been already rejected for visual undercut, porosity, slag inclusions, etc..
And that assumes I havent already busted you for bad setup/ no documentation/ no recording of anything. No weld spec in place .
No preheat record if required etc...
A weld certification has several parts to it.
You have to certify that it is an AWS approved process.
If it isnt, then you need to test and certify that out of bounds process.
Then you need to certify the actual machine settings. Are they welding within the parameters of that certified process.
And you also need to have rock solid documentation for the material that they are welding.
Do you have the "certs"
Is this a bonded material and if so do you have the entire chain of possesion and control for that material.
To pass that very basic basic test your bent coupon can not have any cracks or splits or seperation at all.
None allowed.
And we will test 4 coupons. 2 up, 2 down.
The allowable defect is zero.
All of that is so I will sign off on your 1g cert.
Yep, as a welding inspector you get to sign for it.
And that means that if a structural failure happens from poor welding practices you stand a pretty good chance of being charged with manslaughter.
I know people that have been through that.
I have certified many many people over my career.
I am not certified to inspect pipeline welds or pressure vessel welds.
That is whole different subset of the welding industry.
Welding sheet metal can be difficult.
But in no way is way welding sheet metal anywhere near as difficult and critical and dangerious as structural welding and being an iron worker.
Looky here pal.
Welding a seam on a car isnt easy.
Doing a multi pass back gouge on the 34th floor in winter and making it pass inspection is just maybe a little bit harder to do.
Just maybe.

Feel better?
 

thinger2

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Feel better?
Im doing just fine. Thanks for asking!
I think that your post about sky scrapper welding being simple and sheet metal welding being so much more difficult is a bit of an insult to the structural steel trade and rather ignorant.
Do you really believe that welding cars is more difficult and requires more skill than building high rise massive structures?
Like maybe passing AWS D1.1 is harder than AWS D1.3?
Just a bunch of stick welding monkeys who dont have the talent to patch a car together right?
Come on over, hell ill even let you use my equipment.
If you are that good and know what you are about ill give you a bend test .
If you pass, I will even sign your cert.
1g.
That means you get to tack weld for 6 months untill Im sure.
 

Hipster

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A standard sky scraper/ bridge building etc...cert aint exactly easy either.
We take two pieces of plate and bevel them and you have to multi pass both sides.
Then we cut that plate into "weld coupons" and put them in a press with a 1.5 inch punch and the ends are going over two rollers as it gets pushed into a "U" shape with the punch part pressing on your weld.
Then we take the next coupon and flip it upside down and do it again.
That assumes you havent been already rejected for visual undercut, porosity, slag inclusions, etc..
And that assumes I havent already busted you for bad setup/ no documentation/ no recording of anything. No weld spec in place .
No preheat record if required etc...
A weld certification has several parts to it.
You have to certify that it is an AWS approved process.
If it isnt, then you need to test and certify that out of bounds process.
Then you need to certify the actual machine settings. Are they welding within the parameters of that certified process.
And you also need to have rock solid documentation for the material that they are welding.
Do you have the "certs"
Is this a bonded material and if so do you have the entire chain of possesion and control for that material.
To pass that very basic basic test your bent coupon can not have any cracks or splits or seperation at all.
None allowed.
And we will test 4 coupons. 2 up, 2 down.
The allowable defect is zero.
All of that is so I will sign off on your 1g cert.
Yep, as a welding inspector you get to sign for it.
And that means that if a structural failure happens from poor welding practices you stand a pretty good chance of being charged with manslaughter.
I know people that have been through that.
I have certified many many people over my career.
I am not certified to inspect pipeline welds or pressure vessel welds.
That is whole different subset of the welding industry.
Welding sheet metal can be difficult.
But in no way is way welding sheet metal anywhere near as difficult and critical and dangerious as structural welding and being an iron worker.
Looky here pal.
Welding a seam on a car isnt easy.
Doing a multi pass back gouge on the 34th floor in winter and making it pass inspection is just maybe a little bit harder to do.
Just maybe.
Never said those types of welding jobs or getting certified were easy and I didn't discredit other type of welding cert's other than a class geared toward that type of welding probably wouldn't cover vehicle specific stuff. Autobody is no different as far as liabilities are concerned. If you repair a vehicle and it blows apart in a subsequent accident and someone gets hurt, not only the shop can get sued, they can go after the tech too. My comment was more directed at diy guys that go out and buy a welder and proceed to weld up some scary looking stuff.
 

letitsnow

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Im doing just fine. Thanks for asking!
I think that your post about sky scrapper welding being simple and sheet metal welding being so much more difficult is a bit of an insult to the structural steel trade and rather ignorant.
Do you really believe that welding cars is more difficult and requires more skill than building high rise massive structures?
Like maybe passing AWS D1.1 is harder than AWS D1.3?
Just a bunch of stick welding monkeys who dont have the talent to patch a car together right?
Come on over, hell ill even let you use my equipment.
If you are that good and know what you are about ill give you a bend test .
If you pass, I will even sign your cert.
1g.
That means you get to tack weld for 6 months untill Im sure.

I never posted anything about welding.

I really think that you should look into something like a hockey league to let it out. I race to help myself. Sometimes (when racing) I punt people out of my way just for fun, then I feel better...
 

RichLo

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I didnt see anything about one welder bashing another form of welding. Just people trying to explain to the OP that there is more to auto body welding than making things stick together. Especially considering he is at the 110v flux core level and bench welding in a classroom. Once you get to the point of any professional certification level that usually means you are at the professional level and are at the tip top of the learning curve. This kid is just starting the learning curve.
 

kennythewelder

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There are many different types of welding. Sheet metal work, is nothing like certified pipe welding, and vise versa. You can be extremely good at one, and suck at the other. That's why there are many different welding test, and many different welding certifications. By no means, do you have to be a certified welder to do body repairs, or sheet metal work, but take a certified pipe welder, who never welded sheet metal, and he, or she, won't really know how to weld sheet metal. Every type of welding, has procedures you must follow, to have the proper out come. If you train, and know those for 1 type of welding, that doesn't qualify you for all types of welding. It's all a learning process. The prep work it takes to weld pipe, is not the same as it it to weld plate, and that is not the same as it is to weld sheet metal, ECT, ECT, ECT. Wire welding aluminum, is very different from TIG welding aluminum, ECT, ECT. Personally, I like welding stainless steel, and nickel alloys, but I can weld any metal that can be welded. I have been welding for over 40 years. It took me a very long time to get good at welding many different types of metal, and many different welding processes. Practice, practice, practice, is what it takes. Use scrap material, and see what your doing rite, and what your doing wrong.
 
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