Engine mounts

[L31MaxExpress]

oh i though you had an r/v 88.
it's wider but should fit inside. the original mount has gaps between the rubber and the shell. did you try it?

Agreed on your point of did he try it. The rubber insert should be centered in it from what I remember. The inserts on my Express van were exactly like his OEM mounts. I have energy mounts in the OEM clam shells. The urethane mounts are made larger to add strength and prevent it from being able to move around.

Also just happen to have one of them out of it at the moment to access the bolt holding the 02 sensor wiring.

You must be registered for see images attach

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Schurkey]

I did cram the Poly insert into my steel clamshell. It became immediately apparent that the Poly insert was too large; and that the added width was going to make it difficult to reinstall the through-bolts.

I'd have had to shave the side of the Poly mount to get the bolt hole to line up properly.

In addition, the steel insert within the Poly is shaped incorrectly to line up with the steel bracket bolted to the engine. Both of our photos show how the "tabs" are angled on the Poly mount, but straight up 'n' down on the OEM mount.

 

[GoToGuy]

Did you talk to Energy about problems with fitting the poly insert? Yes they take some muscle grunt to get together. But thats the idea, there not squishy softy rubber isolators. The photos of your original mounts, (orignal factory O.E. ?) They are toast, degraded torn(?), sagging alignment gone. Whats wrong with the bolts holding the clam shell together? Bolts fasten it to the block. I have no problem with using a bolt and nut. I have the advantage of using Aviation hardware. The bolts and locknuts I used are rated 160000 psi. You don't like them, don't use them. There is nothing wrong with product, if you don't like them, unless they are defective, they are not your cup of tea. I have installed a few and previous generation in '86 dually, and others. Yeah there tough to assemble. But the person I ever heard want to shave it down had a set for a diesel engine, oh no!, back to Oriellys. I do the transmission mount also at same time. Good luck.

 

[Schurkey]

Did you talk to Energy about problems with fitting the poly insert?

No. Their Customer Service was helpful on another project, many years ago. Since then, every time I contact them I get no response whatsoever, or their response is that they won't sell the individual items I need--just the entire kit. I quit trying.

Yes they take some muscle grunt to get together. But thats the idea, there not squishy softy rubber isolators. The photos of your original mounts, (orignal factory O.E. ?) They are toast, degraded torn(?), sagging alignment gone. Whats wrong with the bolts holding the clam shell together?

I don't care about the bolts holding the clamshell together, or the "grunt" needed.

The OEM mounts are original. 300,000 miles plus. Of course they're shot. That's why I was hoping to replace them.

Bolts fasten it to the block. I have no problem with using a bolt and nut. I have the advantage of using Aviation hardware. The bolts and locknuts I used are rated 160000 psi. You don't like them, don't use them.

Bolts do not fasten the clamshell to the block. Bolts fasten the clamshell to the frame. Beyond that, I have no idea what bolts you're going on about. I used the OEM bolts and nuts.

There is nothing wrong with product, if you don't like them, unless they are defective, they are not your cup of tea. I have installed a few and previous generation in '86 dually, and others. Yeah there tough to assemble. But the person I ever heard want to shave it down had a set for a diesel engine, oh no!, back to Oriellys. I do the transmission mount also at same time. Good luck.

They DO NOT FIT my vehicle.

1. The steel insert molded within the Polyurethane is not formed properly to match the metal bracket bolted to the engine. It's angled, versus vertical. Easy to see in the various photos.

2. More importantly, the Poly mount is TOO DAMN WIDE. I'd have to slice off a bunch of Poly on the inside of the insert, to get the through-hole to line up with the through-hole on the engine brackets. The big issue that prevented me from using the Poly insert is the through-bolt alignment problem.

Note the alignment of the rubber insert in the original mount. The rubber is crammed all the way to the right side of the clamshell in the photo below. This is also why the rubber insert isn't molded to fit the full width of the clamshell--to allow the rubber insert to "float" inside the clamshell so the through-bolt hole can align with the holes in the engine bracket. This is how my through-bolts align from engine bracket to clamshell insert--both clamshells have the rubber insert pushed to the inside, making the space between the through-bolts shorter than if the rubber insert was centered in the mount like the Poly insert would have to be:

With the Poly insert having extra width, it'd push the through-hole too far to the left in this photo, and I'd never get the through-bolt installed.

The Poly mounts DO NOT FIT MY VEHICLE PROPERLY. They are TOO WIDE. And these photos shows exactly what the width problem is:

 

[GoToGuy]

So your vehicle has clamshells that are not the same as shown in the photos provided by "L31max'" ? When you say " float" how much movement are you talking about? As the design shows, the material is to be captured in the center of the shell. Your reading too much into worn out materials. It shifted from wear, degradation and holding a block of iron, not for floating. Think about it for a second. Unless you have ordered the wrong parts or defectives, this is unique to your ability. So they moulded more material to fit the whole shell shouldn't GM have done that in the first place. You don't like fine, hundreds others do. Not everything is allways perfect. Good luck.

 

[Schurkey]

So your vehicle has clamshells that are not the same as shown in the photos provided by "L31max'" ?

Mine are not like his. His are from an "Express Van". Mine are from a K1500 pickup.

The difference is in how they're mounted. His may bolt to the engine--I don't know. Mine bolt to the frame, and the steel clamshell is formed differently although the rubber insert may/may not be the same. In other words, the attachment is different, the internal space for the isolator insert may/may not be the same. Here's a photo showing how the steel shell is formed to fit on the frame.

You must be registered for see images attach

Note that the crappy aftermarket version of the OEM rubber mount has a narrow rubber insert, and a "vertical" steel support, just like the original. Out-of-the-box, the insert is centered, but with room either direction for the rubber to slide, allowing easy alignment. MY vehicle needs the insert slid this direction on the right side mount. I could do this with the aftermarket rubber mount, but I hate buying Communist crap. If I can't trust them to make the steel shell properly, I can't trust them to use quality rubber, either.

When you say " float" how much movement are you talking about? As the design shows, the material is to be captured in the center of the shell. Your reading too much into worn out materials. It shifted from wear, degradation and holding a block of iron, not for floating.

The rubber insert has ~3/8 inch clearance on either side. Total potential movement would be that much either direction, or ~3/4" total.

The original rubber insert is intended to float either way so that it's easy to line up the through-holes so the through-bolt can go through the front hole in the steel bracket bolted to the engine, through the hole in the clamshell insert, through the rear hole in the engine bracket, and get a nut screwed onto it. The aftermarket Poly insert has no room to float, so if the through holes don't align, you're forced to compress or shave the Poly in an attempt to achieve alignment. THAT was exactly the problem I had.

Think about it for a second. Unless you have ordered the wrong parts or defectives, this is unique to your ability. So they moulded more material to fit the whole shell shouldn't GM have done that in the first place.

GM deliberately did not put so much width into the rubber insert, because they WANTED it to float side-to-side. This makes it easy to get the through-bolt in place, it may/may not also reduce NVH. Nobody from GM explained their design choices, I'm making educated guesses based on my own experience.

Energy Suspension and Summit confirm that the part number I ordered is "correct" (i.e., intended) for my application. And the photo on the Summit site seems to corelate with what I received.

You don't like fine, hundreds others do. Not everything is allways perfect. Good luck.

I know of two, not "hundreds". The mount is obviously too wide. This might be a deliberate re-engineering on the part of Energy Suspension, or it might be a cost-cutting move where they take a part engineered for another application, and expect customers to torture it into working on vehicles it wasn't designed for. Again, nobody from ES asked my opinion or explained their reasoning.

 

[kenh]

It would be my guess the original mound is worn so the through bolt is now off center. With that being the case the engine will sit slightly lower than when new. That issue should resolve itself as the engine will have to set slightly higher in the frame to align the through bolts.

I may have this all wrong but the mounts are on an angle and raising or lowering the engine should allow the holes to line up.

Ken

 

[Schurkey]

I may have this all wrong but the mounts are on an angle and raising or lowering the engine should allow the holes to line up.

Exactly correct. With the rubber insert centered--or the Poly insert being unable to go off-center, the through bolt can't be installed because the mount holes won't align on my vehicle.

The insert has to be slid to one side to fit properly.

Therefore the Poly insert DOES NOT FIT on my truck. GM designed the rubber insert in the clamshell mount to have flexibility in alignment, the Poly insert destroys any hope of adjusting the alignment.