Convertor stall and you

[Erik the Awful]

That's not a 'rule of thumb'. That's dyno time and work.

 

[revmatcher]

Wow a lot of info here...

 

[Danboquist]

Stall for a torque converter, apparently depends on a number of variables. Someone should make a calculator to make it easier to flesh this out.’

#1 is the converter manufacturer. They manufacture them differently.
This is how Hays figures it… https://documents.holley.com/199r11353.pdf

 

[Hipster]

stall is only one part, everything matters. tcs just built me a 2500 stall for my blown vortec, takes off pretty normal, little more rpm, smoother, lights tires easier, trans runs hotter around town and off road, add a cooler with fan on top of the two it may have, I run 3 and still get hot pulling sand hills wot lol. I'm running a bigger body billet single disk converter. I lock it up a little earlier in trans tune to keep mileage up hahaha, has plenty of torque, anyways talk to a couple guys a tcs in lake havasu they will steering you in the right direction, if you have the relevant information. Ill put it in for you and tune it. Torque converters are amazing tech choose wisely.

Agree, a converter will make it or break it, If performance matters, you have to get on the phone and have one built. I wouldn't think @2500 stall it would be cooking it, you say a little hot...........

 

[Hipster]

This is how Hays figures it… https://documents.holley.com/199r11353.pdf

That's overly generic and overly simplified, It's layman's terms, should have a yellow cover on it and be titled "Torque converters for Dummies" Just some brief descriptions on some basic theory/principles.

Get on the phone with FTI, Dynamic Converters, TCS , Turbo/Action etc. and most will realize how unprepared they are. You're not the one asking questions. They are.

Even the pro's get it wrong occasionally, why I said get one built. if not to your liking you get a restall. The right converter is like majic.

Converters are not a one size 1800, 2100 2500, 3500, 4500, 5200 rpm solution like 30 years ago. They have it more scienced out. These days you can get the stall withour the excess slippage and heat.

 

[Sean Buick 76]

The good custom converter builders have you fill out a form with data about your vehicle. Weight, usage, gearing, cam specs, compression, head flow, etc. they also like to see dyno info if possible.

The good lockup converters are expensive but worth it. The factory converters aren’t designed to handle much power on lockup. I used to run a toggle switch on my 700R4 so I could override the lockup and keep it off while I was beating on the truck. The converter in my drag car has a triple disk lockup rated to handle 1000 Hp on lockup but that’s not typical with the mid range $600 converters.

Lastly the lockups are great for a street strip combo but for serious racing the non lock ups are more popular as they are lighter and more reliable on the big power cars and trucks. Some internal changes are required to modify the 4L60E and 80E for a non lockup converter, FYI.

 

[Hipster]

The good custom converter builders have you fill out a form with data about your vehicle. Weight, usage, gearing, cam specs, compression, head flow, etc. they also like to see dyno info if possible.

The good lockup converters are expensive but worth it. The factory converters aren’t designed to handle much power on lockup. I used to run a toggle switch on my 700R4 so I could override the lockup and keep it off while I was beating on the truck. The converter in my drag car has a triple disk lockup rated to handle 1000 Hp on lockup but that’s not typical with the mid range $600 converters.

Lastly the lockups are great for a street strip combo but for serious racing the non lock ups are more popular as they are lighter and more reliable on the big power cars and trucks. Some internal changes are required to modify the 4L60E and 80E for a non lockup converter, FYI.

^^this.....and I'll just say in a performance application 700/4l60 wouldn't be my choice.... nasty 1-2 spread. You got the better choice in your Buick. Bar-none.

 

[GMTMark]

The good custom converter builders have you fill out a form with data about your vehicle. Weight, usage, gearing, cam specs, compression, head flow, etc. they also like to see dyno info if possible.

The good lockup converters are expensive but worth it. The factory converters aren’t designed to handle much power on lockup. I used to run a toggle switch on my 700R4 so I could override the lockup and keep it off while I was beating on the truck. The converter in my drag car has a triple disk lockup rated to handle 1000 Hp on lockup but that’s not typical with the mid range $600 converters.

Lastly the lockups are great for a street strip combo but for serious racing the non lock ups are more popular as they are lighter and more reliable on the big power cars and trucks. Some internal changes are required to modify the 4L60E and 80E for a non lockup converter, FYI.

Very good description. After well over 35 years of drag racing, I couldn’t have said it better without writing a novel. The science of torque converters can be complex and I suggest that if a person finds a company that can build one to your satisfaction, stick with them.

 

[Sean Buick 76]

Very good description. After well over 35 years of drag racing, I couldn’t have said it better without writing a novel. The science of torque converters can be complex and I suggest that if a person finds a company that can build one to your satisfaction, stick with them.

A few more pieces of info that can help others.

A higher stall converter is often referred to as a 2500 stall, 3500 etc. what this really means is that it’s designed to slip up from idle to that rpm. I prefer to call it the flash rpm as it has nothing to do with the “stall”. When the converter flash’s up to a higher rpm as the vehicle leaves from a stop this allows torque multiplication and better acceleration along with a secondary benefit that it allows a “cammed” engine to jump up into its power band range without bogging. The same cammed engine with a stock converter would bog a bit till it got to 2500 or 3000 or wherever the power came on with that combo.

The cool thing about the lockup converters is that you can have your cake and eat it too! I have a 4500 stall converter that I can flip the toggle switch and lockup 100% on the highway.

You whipper snappers won’t remember the days (th350 and 400)when it was either a high stall wit excess heat or tight stall and slower off the line but less heat and HP loss on the top end of the track. A high $ converter can do both but pony up. I’ve paid $900 for converter but man do they launch and couple up on the big end!

 

[Sean Buick 76]

^^this.....and I'll just say in a performance application 700/4l60 wouldn't be my choice.... nasty 1-2 spread. You got the better choice in your Buick. Bar-none.

Yes it’s a billet 2004R, different ratios, lighter and it’s been working for me.