c-notch question

[sled]

My first real post so forgive me for the newb question. I have a 91 std cab I'm about to do a 5/7 on. I plan on using DJM 3" coils, DJM 2" spindles for the front, I'm not really sure what flip kit since I believe they are all about the same. I also have a 2" shackle for the rear if needed. Ill be running 20" boss 304's and I haven't really made up my mind on tire sizes but that's easy info to find. Now to my question.

Which notch is best to use that will give me the largest under bed notch but still allow me to have some tow capacity? I know, I know. not possible to have both lol.

I think ive narrowed it down to three kits ive found. The one you mentioned above which is nfamous metals no bed cut notch, a similar design sold on avs airbag parts which looks like the reinforcement tubing is longer - s://www.avsontheweb.com/super-c-notch-88-98-and-99-04-gm-full-size-mount-under-floor-no-cutting/ , or I have some interest in the street grip c notch because it looks like its spread over a longer section of the frame allowing for more strength - https://www.ridetech.com/products/suspension-packages/1988-1998-c1500-streetgrip-suspension-system/

any opinions on this would be helpful. lowred, sorry for the thread jack, I didn't want to create another post with the same questions and maybe these would be helpful for you as well.

 

[gearheadE30]

As for the wheel weights, I noticed the day I put the 4” drop up front and tried to turn the truck around in the driveway, I popped 3 weights off. If you wanna rock 15s, you’re gonna have to commit to sacrificing your LCAs. I plan on running a bunch of SCCA type of events with my truck so I didn’t want to give up that much reinforcement to the LCA to get full turn radius with a set of wheels I won’t run for long. I’ve seen people attest to running the LCAs cut that much with no ill effects, but I just don’t trust it.

Tires on the truck are 235/75/15. Way to skinny for my taste but they were new on the truck when I bought it. I rolled the front fenders cause I have the belltech spindles and wanted to make damn sure I had no issues with rubbing. To date, no issues at all rubbing front or rear on the fenders. I have the belltech 2”-3” drop springs up front but they are softer than I would prefer. I think I’m scrubbing the front valence when I’m at throttle and hit one of those bumps that test your suspension. I plan to cut about 2/3s of a coil off the factory coils I pulled out and see if I can feel/hear a difference.

I'm not sure where the idea that it's just 15s that interfere came from. At this point, I would recommend anyone with spindles check their clearance, and if you're on 18" wheels or smaller with reasonable width, expect the arms to need attention. I had to cut quite a lot off of mine with the impala SS wheels even.

Stock cut springs won't be stiff enough either. I have Chevy Express van springs in the front of mine (I think; would have to check what I settled on) with a coil cut off. They are about 1500 lb/in vs stock 850ish lb/in. I still haven't found stiff enough shocks, but the springs feel spot on and I have no issues with bottoming. Video:

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Which notch is best to use that will give me the largest under bed notch but still allow me to have some tow capacity? I know, I know. not possible to have both lol.

Can't help you on maximum clearance, but to keep your towing capacity, you will either need bags or stiffer leaf springs if you're going to be hauling much at all. It's worth it to do it right just because of the safety concern if you don't. Extra weight on the axle means you're going to be using more of whatever travel you have, and you'll be dragging stuff on the ground if you just let it sag out. And you will need to be very careful with how you install the notch, since you're basically cutting the load path that supports the receiver and allowing the frame to flex more. If you're going to tow, I'd be looking at welding the notch just to be safe.

 

[sled]

So I went with the AVS super C notch with is weld in. With that being said there is a certain amount to fabrication needed, because of that, they do not come with installation instructions. This brings my next point. To my knowledge you take the outer plate and cup the existing frame wall and weld it into place. Then cut out the area for the notch. At that point you put in the cap in the underside capping off the area that you cut for the axle.

Has anyone reversed these plates and rather than putting the outer plate on the outside of the frame, put it on the inside of the frame? Doing this would essentially box in the frame using the supplies you have not needing additional steel to do so. Is this something that can be done? good idea? bad idea? because?

 

[sled]

So does anyone have a lead on a belltech flip kit for a 91 c1500 without the notch? I can only find listings with the notch and well I don't need one since im going with the AVS one. May not be the correct place for this post. if not I don't mind deleting.

 

[Crytone]

So I went with the AVS super C notch with is weld in. With that being said there is a certain amount to fabrication needed, because of that, they do not come with installation instructions. This brings my next point. To my knowledge you take the outer plate and cup the existing frame wall and weld it into place. Then cut out the area for the notch. At that point you put in the cap in the underside capping off the area that you cut for the axle.

Has anyone reversed these plates and rather than putting the outer plate on the outside of the frame, put it on the inside of the frame? Doing this would essentially box in the frame using the supplies you have not needing additional steel to do so. Is this something that can be done? good idea? bad idea? because?

It would not be wise to install the plates in that manner. It would provide minimal frame support. It would create a weak point on the unsupported frame side that is now cut also that's just asking to crack. The only thing holding it in would be a few welds on the top/bottom of the frame. If you want to box it, get new metal to place on the inside - fairly cheap to do anyways. That's one reason I like the Reklez c notch kit, it boxes in the frame also.

So does anyone have a lead on a belltech flip kit for a 91 c1500 without the notch? I can only find listings with the notch and well I don't need one since im going with the AVS one. May not be the correct place for this post. if not I don't mind deleting.

They don't list anything on their site but it is probably worth asking them if they sell the set separate. I know other companies (McGaughy #33144) have the flip only without a notch. Always worth it to ask Belltech and/or one of their distributors. Look at the vendor section, theres one vendor there that deals in Belltech/DJM stuff and may be able to get an answer also.

 

[sewlow]

So does anyone have a lead on a belltech flip kit for a 91 c1500 without the notch? I can only find listings with the notch and well I don't need one since im going with the AVS one. May not be the correct place for this post. if not I don't mind deleting.

If you`ve got the skills to be slicing & dicing on your frame in order to get that super-notch welded in there, then you`ve got the skills to do this...
Don`t bother with a flip-kit. They`re a comprimise at best. Especially if you expect to be doing some towing or maybe throwing some `real`power at the truck later on down the road.
This just makes more sense. None of those unwelded clamps just pinching the axle tubes via 2 bolts. Much more simple.

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[sled]

It would not be wise to install the plates in that manner. It would provide minimal frame support. It would create a weak point on the unsupported frame side that is now cut also that's just asking to crack. The only thing holding it in would be a few welds on the top/bottom of the frame. If you want to box it, get new metal to place on the inside - fairly cheap to do anyways. That's one reason I like the Reklez c notch kit, it boxes in the frame also.



They don't list anything on their site but it is probably worth asking them if they sell the set separate. I know other companies (McGaughy #33144) have the flip only without a notch. Always worth it to ask Belltech and/or one of their distributors. Look at the vendor section, there's one vendor there that deals in Belltech/DJM stuff and may be able to get an answer also.

yeah I thought about that shortly after I posted it. it would be different if I were boxing it in fully and I may further down the line but I understand after thinking about it how it would actually be weaker. I wish I would of known about the reklez kit a week ago, I already own the avs...

If you`ve got the skills to be slicing & dicing on your frame in order to get that super-notch welded in there, then you`ve got the skills to do this...
Don`t bother with a flip-kit. They`re a compromise at best. Especially if you expect to be doing some towing or maybe throwing some `real`power at the truck later on down the road.
This just makes more sense. None of those unwelded clamps just pinching the axle tubes via 2 bolts. Much more simple.

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I agree, I guess I just didn't think about that. I'm not personally welding it because I don't own a welder, I have done framework myself in the past but it was on mini's, this is my first fullsize chevy. The welder welds by trade (friend of a friend) and will probable just be working off my direction if he just doesn't allow me to do it myself. Overall doing it the way you suggest id be worried about welding the seat in the correct location and allowing for the correct pinion angle. I'm not experienced enough in doing this to know how to do that. I also see you axle is broken down in pic, I don't want to have to do that and wouldn't I need to do that if I were going to weld on the axle?

 

[sewlow]

Don't have to tear down the axle to weld on it. The rear end was all apart for a complete rebuild. It was just easier to move in & out while it was empty.
I had to replace an axle bearing & things morphed from there into a full-blown diff rebuild with an Eaton 'posi', 3.73's, Moser axles, custom frame notch, some frame boxing, boxing of the box's crossmember notch, upper shock mount relocation, custom sway bar mounts, those spring perches & the new lower plates. Oooops!

Agree on the pinion angle. Buddy that had the shop I was working in, set that up.

 

[gearheadE30]

That probably is a good way to do the axle flip... I have the DJM kit and keep having issues with the pinion angle moving around on me. Everything is staying tight, but it's still not enough to keep it all in place. Have had to adjust it every 5k miles or so, which means I'll probably have to do something similar as soon as it gets warm out again.

 

[sled]

I didn’t have enough experience to mess with pinion angle myself so I went with the mcgaughy c notch, straight forward and simple, my only complaint is it would of been nice to get new u-bolts. My AVS notch came out good also.

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