1998 C2500 Front Disc Brakes Squeak

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autoteleology

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So, I've been having a chronic problem with my front breaks squeaking during a moderate to hard stop. I've tried basically everything I could think of - I've replaced the calipers, the rotors, and even changed the brake pads from semi-metallic to ceramic, and while the issue has improved (it's more of an exception instead of being the norm, and when they do squeak, it's not nearly as loud), it's not gone away, and it still bothers me.

My mechanic swears up and down over and over that this is normal behavior for a 3/4 ton truck but I don't know whether to believe them or not. My coworker, who is a retired mechanic, says my mechanic is full of it and offers their 2002 Yukon XL as a counterexample (they claim their brakes don't squeak at all).

What do you think? Is my mechanic right, and if they are wrong, what could I do to address the issue, and should I give them the boot for wasting my money and time? I'm a total amateur when it comes to truly understanding how to work on my vehicle and what I should expect in terms of peak performance from this vehicle, so an outside perspective on this situation would be much appreciated.
 

thinger2

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Yes squeaking brakes are common.
That doesnt mean they are normal.
If brake squeak was normal on a 3/4 ton truck, every construction site in America would sound like it was being attacked by Geese.
Your retired friend is right, the mechanic is full of ****.
That doesnt mean that it is his fault.
Brakes seem to be a simple thing. Schlap some pads on er!
Nope.
But first, Lets make sure its not pilot error.
Are you a brake rider?
Face it, the brakes on these things suck.
I think GM used a Betty Crocker sponge cake recipe for the design.
If you are riding the brakes even just a little you will glaze them over and over no matter whats in the caliper.
Its a real common habit.
The Titanic had a better stopping distance.
But a whole bunch of other stuff can cause this.
The squeak you hear is actually the brake components vibrating at a very high frequency.
Sometimes you just get lucky and those parts resonate at the same frequency so basically the pad the frame the caliper rotor backing plate all combine.
Think of it like ringing a bell, or maybe a bunch of bells.
This is all designed out of the system but,
Driving habits, aftermarket parts, brake drag etc...
The basic stuff
Caliper pins sticking or worn causing incomplete release of the pad.
Anti rattle clip missing or worn same as above.
cheap ass pads. look at the frame of the pad. chances are it has all kinds of burrs and sharp edges that can dig in and stop them from moving freely.
File that **** kids, same goes for rear shoes.
Brake grease and anti squeak compound are not the same thing.
And, buy the pads with shims and use the shims. Its not a spare part.
Check the hub and the backside of the rim. Look for rusty crustules of crap and clean them. If you have a 4x4 with alloys, make sure you didnt peel a big burr off of the inside of the rim the last time you whacked it on at 237 foot pounds.
And, dont nail the cv nut on with an impact and then use the same impact on the lugs.
You can bend the rotor and hog out an alloy so bad it cracks.
And dont tell me about your torque sticks.
Use a torque wrench.
But, the number one cause of front brake noise on a chevy truck is the back brakes. Yep. are they doing anything or are they just along for the ride? Pull the drums make sure the backs are working. They stick, they bind, they dig grooves into the backing plate that makes them hang.
All of this causes heat glaze on the fronts.
But, op ive led you down the path from no info to to too much info.
If you have any questions, fire away
And yes, your mechanic is full of ****.
He either doesnt want to deal with it or doesnt know how to.
 

HotWheelsBurban

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2X!!! Clean, lubricate with proper and appropriate brake grease, inspect everything, reassemble it properly.
Even when doing all this, there can still be problems. My recent experience with needing to clean the threads in the spindle that the caliper mounting bolts go into is a case in point. Never had to do that before, may never have to do it again. If I do though I have the tool and the experience to do the job right.....
Rotors and drums do get a little rust glaze on their braking surfaces overnight or when sitting for extended periods. I live in Houston, Texas where it's usually humid. My Burb 's brakes sound horrible in the morning, the first few stops. Sounds like bare metal, all the linings fell off...but after 3 or 4 good stops it's quiet. Stops as normal.
When we get into the fall and cooler weather, I'll be seeing to the rear shoes. A mechanic I trust did the wheel cylinders 4 years ago, and I imagine he lubricated all the wear points. But after all this time, it's probably dried up. So that will be redone when shoes are replaced. Maybe I will replace the hardware if it looks worn or overheated. Hardware kits are cheap compared to replacing everything again or continued brake problems though.....
 

TheAutumnWind

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Yes squeaking brakes are common.
That doesnt mean they are normal.
If brake squeak was normal on a 3/4 ton truck, every construction site in America would sound like it was being attacked by Geese.
Your retired friend is right, the mechanic is full of ****.
That doesnt mean that it is his fault.
Brakes seem to be a simple thing. Schlap some pads on er!
Nope.
But first, Lets make sure its not pilot error.
Are you a brake rider?
Face it, the brakes on these things suck.
I think GM used a Betty Crocker sponge cake recipe for the design.
If you are riding the brakes even just a little you will glaze them over and over no matter whats in the caliper.
Its a real common habit.
The Titanic had a better stopping distance.
But a whole bunch of other stuff can cause this.
The squeak you hear is actually the brake components vibrating at a very high frequency.
Sometimes you just get lucky and those parts resonate at the same frequency so basically the pad the frame the caliper rotor backing plate all combine.
Think of it like ringing a bell, or maybe a bunch of bells.
This is all designed out of the system but,
Driving habits, aftermarket parts, brake drag etc...
The basic stuff
Caliper pins sticking or worn causing incomplete release of the pad.
Anti rattle clip missing or worn same as above.
cheap ass pads. look at the frame of the pad. chances are it has all kinds of burrs and sharp edges that can dig in and stop them from moving freely.
File that **** kids, same goes for rear shoes.
Brake grease and anti squeak compound are not the same thing.
And, buy the pads with shims and use the shims. Its not a spare part.
Check the hub and the backside of the rim. Look for rusty crustules of crap and clean them. If you have a 4x4 with alloys, make sure you didnt peel a big burr off of the inside of the rim the last time you whacked it on at 237 foot pounds.
And, dont nail the cv nut on with an impact and then use the same impact on the lugs.
You can bend the rotor and hog out an alloy so bad it cracks.
And dont tell me about your torque sticks.
Use a torque wrench.
But, the number one cause of front brake noise on a chevy truck is the back brakes. Yep. are they doing anything or are they just along for the ride? Pull the drums make sure the backs are working. They stick, they bind, they dig grooves into the backing plate that makes them hang.
All of this causes heat glaze on the fronts.
But, op ive led you down the path from no info to to too much info.
If you have any questions, fire away
And yes, your mechanic is full of ****.
He either doesnt want to deal with it or doesnt know how to.

As a GC I can tell you that squeaky brakes on contractors trucks is the norm, not the exception. Some of that is maintenance, but quite a bit is that fleet vehicles use pads that perform well and are cheap, but dont give a **** about noise or dust.
 

thinger2

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As a GC I can tell you that squeaky brakes on contractors trucks is the norm, not the exception. Some of that is maintenance, but quite a bit is that fleet vehicles use pads that perform well and are cheap, but dont give a **** about noise or dust.
Ha! Im a semi retired structural steel project manager.
We are lucky if our trucks make to the first brake change!
 

thinger2

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2X!!! Clean, lubricate with proper and appropriate brake grease, inspect everything, reassemble it properly.
Even when doing all this, there can still be problems. My recent experience with needing to clean the threads in the spindle that the caliper mounting bolts go into is a case in point. Never had to do that before, may never have to do it again. If I do though I have the tool and the experience to do the job right.....
Rotors and drums do get a little rust glaze on their braking surfaces overnight or when sitting for extended periods. I live in Houston, Texas where it's usually humid. My Burb 's brakes sound horrible in the morning, the first few stops. Sounds like bare metal, all the linings fell off...but after 3 or 4 good stops it's quiet. Stops as normal.
When we get into the fall and cooler weather, I'll be seeing to the rear shoes. A mechanic I trust did the wheel cylinders 4 years ago, and I imagine he lubricated all the wear points. But after all this time, it's probably dried up. So that will be redone when shoes are replaced. Maybe I will replace the hardware if it looks worn or overheated. Hardware kits are cheap compared to replacing everything again or continued brake problems though.....
Im in the northwest so our rainy season is pretty much 9 months. I have a dirt alleyway that has a big mud bog at either end of it.
I knew the previous owner had the rears done shortly before I bought it so I was kinda surprised when I started getting problems.
Turns out the brake guy left both of the rubber plugs for the adjusters out of the backing plate and the drums were about 1/3 rd full of baked mud.
It was a mess
 

autoteleology

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Thanks, everyone, for replying to my question. Sorry it took me so long to get back to this post, I have a lot of stuff going on and I wanted to wait until I was able to solve the problem, but I still haven't look at it and I didn't want to leave people just hanging forever like a time waster.

2X!!! Clean, lubricate with proper and appropriate brake grease, inspect everything, reassemble it properly.
Even when doing all this, there can still be problems. My recent experience with needing to clean the threads in the spindle that the caliper mounting bolts go into is a case in point. Never had to do that before, may never have to do it again. If I do though I have the tool and the experience to do the job right.....
Rotors and drums do get a little rust glaze on their braking surfaces overnight or when sitting for extended periods. I live in Houston, Texas where it's usually humid. My Burb 's brakes sound horrible in the morning, the first few stops. Sounds like bare metal, all the linings fell off...but after 3 or 4 good stops it's quiet. Stops as normal.

I'm aware of the potential for rust glazing from moisture but I don't think this is the issue with my rotors. I mean, they're new, I don't live in a humid climate, and I park on a gravel driveway, not a dirt lot or on the grass. It seems to go away and come back at random, not on a consistent time basis.

As a GC I can tell you that squeaky brakes on contractors trucks is the norm, not the exception. Some of that is maintenance, but quite a bit is that fleet vehicles use pads that perform well and are cheap, but dont give a **** about noise or dust.

Well, sure, but I'm assuming that's with semi-metallic pads, not ceramics. I don't feel like I should be having this problem with new rotors and ceramic pads.

Yes squeaking brakes are common.
That doesnt mean they are normal.
If brake squeak was normal on a 3/4 ton truck, every construction site in America would sound like it was being attacked by Geese.
Your retired friend is right, the mechanic is full of ****.
That doesnt mean that it is his fault.
Brakes seem to be a simple thing. Schlap some pads on er!
Nope.
But first, Lets make sure its not pilot error.
Are you a brake rider?
Face it, the brakes on these things suck.
I think GM used a Betty Crocker sponge cake recipe for the design.
If you are riding the brakes even just a little you will glaze them over and over no matter whats in the caliper.
Its a real common habit.
The Titanic had a better stopping distance.
But a whole bunch of other stuff can cause this.
The squeak you hear is actually the brake components vibrating at a very high frequency.
Sometimes you just get lucky and those parts resonate at the same frequency so basically the pad the frame the caliper rotor backing plate all combine.
Think of it like ringing a bell, or maybe a bunch of bells.
This is all designed out of the system but,
Driving habits, aftermarket parts, brake drag etc...
The basic stuff
Caliper pins sticking or worn causing incomplete release of the pad.
Anti rattle clip missing or worn same as above.
cheap ass pads. look at the frame of the pad. chances are it has all kinds of burrs and sharp edges that can dig in and stop them from moving freely.
File that **** kids, same goes for rear shoes.
Brake grease and anti squeak compound are not the same thing.
And, buy the pads with shims and use the shims. Its not a spare part.
Check the hub and the backside of the rim. Look for rusty crustules of crap and clean them. If you have a 4x4 with alloys, make sure you didnt peel a big burr off of the inside of the rim the last time you whacked it on at 237 foot pounds.
And, dont nail the cv nut on with an impact and then use the same impact on the lugs.
You can bend the rotor and hog out an alloy so bad it cracks.
And dont tell me about your torque sticks.
Use a torque wrench.
But, the number one cause of front brake noise on a chevy truck is the back brakes. Yep. are they doing anything or are they just along for the ride? Pull the drums make sure the backs are working. They stick, they bind, they dig grooves into the backing plate that makes them hang.
All of this causes heat glaze on the fronts.
But, op ive led you down the path from no info to to too much info.
If you have any questions, fire away
And yes, your mechanic is full of ****.
He either doesnt want to deal with it or doesnt know how to.

I'm not a brake rider, I give plenty of distance between myself and the car in front of me. I consider myself a pretty good driver, but then again, so does everyone.

I would be really surprised if the cause of the brakes squeaking is the rear drums, because they're also fairly new as well. I can also hear them working when I have someone press the brake pedal while I'm on the outside of the truck.

I've been pretty ambivalent with this mechanic shop for a while. They don't seem like outright scammers but as I've learned more about cars I've realized that they're likely somewhat incompetent and that I should probably stop doing business with them. I'm not happy about how much I paid for a brake job (that really didn't even need to be done, strictly speaking) to get rid of this pervasive squeak just for it to end up not getting fixed. Considering that they just did this brake job and I'm not happy with it, do I have any recourse or leverage to get them to try to do a better job (especially considering that I've spent quite a money at this shop in particular)?

As far as the actual nitty gritty as to what could be causing the problem, you're right that it is a bit too much for me at the moment. I haven't done any of the work on my own car yet, though I've done quite a lot of research about car technology in general. Clearly, though, I have to learn how to do this work, because paying a mechanic to do work for me has ended up being way more expensive than I would have liked, for quality that doesn't meet the standards that I expect. You know what they say, if you want something done right, you have to do it yourself. I would have tried to do my own work long before this if it didn't seem like such a daunting and unapproachable task to teach myself without knowing anyone who can help guide me to a point of basic competency when I can't afford to screw up my daily driver playing around. It is only after training this co-worker as a new hire recently and learning that they used to work on cars professionally that I know anyone who knows anything about cars.

For what it's worth, I figured I'd also post a picture of my truck, just for fun. It's not in the most pristine condition or anything but it's also not a junk heap, either. I was given it as my first car by my aunt after her husband died; it was their work truck. I replaced the wheels because they were corroded into oblivion. I've also had it ECU tuned after I had to replace the ECU anyway when the Passlock failed (if only all car work was that easy... saved myself from paying the $1200 my genius mechanic wanted, too).

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frito-bandito

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As others have already stated, but it’s worth mentioning again, the only thing shittier on these truck than the front brakes, are the rear brakes lol.
 

autoteleology

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As others have already stated, but it’s worth mentioning again, the only thing shittier on these truck than the front brakes, are the rear brakes lol.

But, surely this isn't normal behavior for what is basically new hardware on every wheel? These trucks couldn't possibly have rolled off the factory line squeaking like this, right?
 
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